I am glad to help! Eleonora is my pet subject!
Monica
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Natalie
Sent: Monday, May 08, 2006 8:23 PM
To: Historical Costume
Subject: Re: [h-cost] Eleanor of Toledo 1545 help
Monica,
Thanks for the insight! I knew she had had many children, and was a woman of
substance (like me!) but I didn't know how she had died. The velvet bodice
makes perfect sense as an alternative to the steel corset for an aging/dying
woman.
Thanks for the help!
Natalie
----- Original Message -----
From: "monica spence" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Historical Costume" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, May 08, 2006 8:04 PM
Subject: RE: [h-cost] Eleanor of Toledo 1545 help
> Hi Natalie--
> You can make the gown without an underbodice and kirtle over a corset.
> How
> many people at the Faire will notice? You are the one dealing with the
> heat!
>
> About The Eleonora dress:
>
> The red velvet pair of bodies was lines with (believe it or not) paper. It
> had no bones. You could probably substitute a hair canvas or a type of
> buckram that does not react to heat/ sweat. It was not made for the gown
> she
> was buried in-- it was too big and had a different waistline.
>
> Now here is the story behind this. Eleonora died in December of 1562 and
> was
> NOT embalmed. Getting from Pisa, where she died, to Florence, where she
> was
> buried, took days since she was being moved in a "train" with wagons and
> horses, etc. I am sure that there was not a lot of ice around in those
> days
> ("Poor Judd is dead" the song from "Oklahoma" tells of the down side of
> being kept unburied without ice...) At any rate, by the time she got home,
> people were probably moving at warp 9 to get her dressed in something
> appropriate. Cosimo her husband was very distraught, (he had just lost 2
> sons and a daughter within a very short time before Eleonora died, so
> "crazy
> with grief" was probably a good way to describe it), but he wanted his
> wife
> to be properly dressed-- jewels included-- for her appointment with her
> Maker.
>
> If you look at the text of Janet Arnold's book she says something about
> the
> velvet bodice overlapping in the front. Eleonora had been suffering from
> TB
> on and off, getting progressively worse , since 1549/ 50 until her death.
> In
> the early stages she wore a taffeta covered steel corset (not recommended
> for the modern woman). The velvet bodice MIGHT have been something she
> wore
> as a substitute when breathing became difficult (my hypothesis). In the
> severe stages of TB there is terrible weight loss. If you look at some of
> the pics by Bronzino you can see how she gained weight over the course of
> her many (11) pregnancies, and then lost a lot of weight at the end. She
> was
> one sick lady. And putting the malaria on top of it, well, it is no
> surprise
> that the stuff in her wardrobe did not fit. The velvet bodice was probably
> more of a grave wrapping to keep her upper body set while the people were
> trying to get her gown laced. If you notice the gown is not laced through
> every hole-- they were working fast probably. And who would think that 500
> years later what she wore in her grave would be the subject of such
> intense
> scrutiny? (The grave robbers who took her jewels flipped the body over, so
> that is why the back of the dress and velvet bodice are in such good
> shape.
> The body decays from the top down-- gravity and all that!)
>
> Eleonora's dress was probably lined in linen. Since linen is a natural
> fiber, it decomposes in the grave. It also protected the satin of the
> dress
> from the same fate, but if the body had been left to decompose long enough
> everything probably would have gone.
>
> The latest book on Eleonora, "Moda di Firenze"
> http://www.artbooks.com/wc.dll?ab~searchitemno~0~45409 gives a lot of
> details on the EoT gown and the restoration of both pieces. The skirt was
> cut so it would be worn without a forepart.
>
> Janet Arnold did the preliminary work on the gown, but died prior to this
> new book being released. Her theory was the gown probably had an
> embroidered
> smock and no sleeves. She also theorized that Eleonora probably wore a
> farthingale, because she was Spanish. The waistline of her gown was more
> rounded than the Elizabethan style of 1575, and had a different silhouette
> then the Eleonora gown from the Bronzino painting, which was 30 years
> earlier.
>
>
> Good luck with the gown!
> Best Regards-
> Monica
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Natalie
> Sent: Monday, May 08, 2006 6:18 PM
> To: Historical Costume
> Subject: [h-cost] Eleanor of Toledo 1545 help
>
>
> Hello everyone,
>
> I am looking for some guidance on the Eleanor of Toledo gown. I have read
> over Janet Arnold's write up of this dress and the book describes not one,
> but two bodices based on remnants of the actual dress. The first bodice
> was
> of velvet, and fastens at the front with hooks and eyes, and lined with
> linen, but no matching skirt was found, although there are stitch-holes in
> the waist.
>
> The second bodice is of satin, with two seams at the back. It may have
> been
> lined, but the evidence is not clear, per Arnold.
>
> The book theorizes that the velvet bodice may have been a corset with
> bents,
> or a "pair of bodies," set into the linen lining, to support an underskirt
> of velvet.
>
> So that's the back story. Based on that gown and the Elizabeth 1575 gown,
> I
> have designed the following:
> http://www.fantasy-sewing.com/images/dressconcept.jpg
>
> My question is, if I wear a standard corset and farthingale, is there
> really
> any need for the heavy under-bodice/skirt combo (kirtle?)? I am not sure
> yet
> what I will make the overdress of, but it will probably be interlined
> brocade, with something lighter for the underskirt and an interchangeable
> forepart. I live in Michigan, and the faires here are held in the late
> heat
> of summer, so I don't want to make it too heavy!
>
> Natalie
>
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