Aren’t you the guy who thought Pharmacies weren’t open 24 by 7? Metz is right, if you think the mainframe is a batch machine, you’ve got zero credibility.
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone On Sunday, June 19, 2022, 4:51 PM, David Crayford <dcrayf...@gmail.com> wrote: On 20/06/2022 4:21 am, Bill Johnson wrote: > Most mainframes store transactions and process in batch? Are you the same guy > who didn’t know pharmacies are open 24 by 7? Go and have a nap Bill. And don't forget to take your meds when you wake up. > > Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone > > > On Sunday, June 19, 2022, 2:03 PM, David Crayford <dcrayf...@gmail.com> wrote: > > On 20/06/2022 12:38 am, Seymour J Metz wrote: >> Keep in mind that the mainframe can only do batch processing, with input >> from cards. It doesn't support anything like CICS, IMS or Sabre.. > What have transactional systems like CICS or IMS got to do with > real-time, straight-through processing? Most mainframe transactions > store data that is later processed by batch, typically overnight. In the > case of banking transactions that require inter-bank settlements this > can cause delays of several days. In Australia the government mandated > the NPP (New Payments Platform) which facilities instant payments using > payids, which can be an email address, cellphone numbers etc. The API is > a simple REST API using HTTP > https://nppa.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/NPP-API-Framework-v4.0-Final.pdf. > It's my understanding that no bank implemented NPP on the mainframe. > From the presentations I've seen they used CDC to capture writes and > then published events to Kafka, which was fanned out to different > micro-services to do fraud detection, payments, push notifications etc. > Back in the day straight-through processing was a pipe dream which is > why we have overnight batch. It's a relic of applications written > decades ago for very different hardware platforms. > > >> It's much better to run Linux than to get an IFL, which can only run batch. > I have no idea what you mean? > >> Cynical? Moi? >> >> >> -- >> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz >> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 >> >> ________________________________________ >> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of >> David Crayford [dcrayf...@gmail.com] >> Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2022 2:36 AM >> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU >> Subject: Re: Modernize Mainframe Applications for Hybrid Cloud with IBM and >> AWS >> >> On 19/06/2022 5:23 am, Enzo D'Amato wrote: >>> I also agree, but as a non-insider, I wanted to know what others were >>> thinking. I also belive that in most cases, the effort spent trying to get >>> off the mainframe would be better spent actually fixing the code running on >>> it in the first place. Moving around broken code doesn't automatically fix >>> it. >> It's not just about fixing broken code. If you read the ING CIO's >> remarks about why they wanted off the mainframe it's not about the >> platform. Nobody denies that mainframes are insanely brilliant hardware >> platforms. ING wanted to get rid of batch and move towards an event >> driven architecture using pub/sub where they can easily deploy loosely >> coupled micro-services to provide cutting edge products. The technology >> stacks are built on open source such as Kafka, MongoDB, Cassandra, NiFi, >> Avro etc. The retail banking industry has been disrupted by fintechs so >> waiting for an overnight batch schedule for settlements is a competitive >> disadvantage. Cracking open and modernizing 50-60 year old COBOL batch >> applications is a VERY heavy lift. >> >> https://secure-web.cisco.com/1GoiNO6FBPSWW0D9FZYVYixer1jsPeSd_xH-wmi6jMOC-onAkZQ4Pkf3c1UMGWbQeEprnkSWa1xGxz4vvn-LF0jVrCFlVVFZKQJ4Jti8nbQ7QchsOxhwNiwluJrdKkQP2nXXHQH2Ut2NNa9VChfVBIDR7Akw4ud6_pIXLAFXO5l73Sv-iLZFNU1MWWnLapWhhCKvytdzs7EJTvNZ2qbU8xwCdBEl1UkUuL-jHHZLk6xJPxAadVRWP1nuLz8i5AZrfvDI8u8rZ0V0DT77_Uvu8klHLbL9xe2qaYi1P6a6mc8r9Aj2jothGC-CR9cbCgb-JVXupgin9UctH5C_iVMyn_T-9jzZjtNyZDETxb8hXMU-BOuUz89MGu1nniZJ2tvSSN8yh5A6K-_It8fA10UFCfSBhOB0NVkwKL5M8A2BxZ9_e111GnxGK_PAbj0wh5fvU/https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theregister.com%2F2016%2F07%2F01%2Fing_mainframe_strategy%2F >> <- read >> the comments section. It's hilarious :) >> >> The doubly whammy is there's a skills crisis slowly unraveling. In the >> last year we've had 3 key resources move to 3 day weeks with a view to >> retiring. Replacing highly skilled assembler programmers with deep >> subsystem knowledge is proving to be difficult. Young people don't want >> to learn HLASM as they consider it a dead-end. Their position is "why >> invest 3-4 years learning a language that is useless if you move to >> another industry?" I can't comment about COBOL application developers. >> >> In 10 years time I expect the mainframe to be alive and kicking and >> significantly modernized. The small/medium shops will probably be all >> gone. When I first moved to my current town in 1998 there were 25-30 >> mainframe sites. Now there are 3 and 1 is on life support. One of our >> customers re-platformed their CICS/COBOL/Batch applications from a z9 to >> a single blade server. It doesn't make any sense financially for a small >> site to run a mainframe. >> https://secure-web.cisco.com/1-2iTgedz9DPApFopeywjfCeLAkb4kS8D5gFCEDU1FxvGiDWA4ou6pqJyb1d_hBAvGUBtcA89RrAylX3opaG2YEyDaGkIhptpRdukdHvdGOJNKn5bruFlKlnigitV6PrV4n-6zInQkhkJJdSriM40VeYiNOpB8Pg3nTa5E6k6TTIOXSfdaiQOGk1Y6EXL4Xtu-wkeXJmwaPEZljVo3KuwR0K75lrsX8fDe2f2CjcjvfrM3ruLG4na4zrAU_pR4DViMh7bKBhJ35a94VHU7GR4Vh_mXKaYwtbhwnRJWR8gVkvYjmB2CjTOIxJE52bNN1-82_fpYopX-kZQntDkR4OKjvj-b1AV9yXlGQ3A-eGFbtuCb0_1t2R9tgZ5MqgMbzxGQKIf78I2U_xq8a9qYywx3_OgfQwbeMgd8fiatdC5CbUSlphDlQfSDw9sOErejC7z/https%3A%2F%2Fwww.itnews.com.au%2Fnews%2Fwa-insurance-commission-decommissions-mainframe-322780 >> >>> Get BlueMail for >>> Android<https://secure-web.cisco.com/1bcgENTOsK8XbQ24q-R3ISXJI_yYDqxq2wHDg7brpU3Np08gk-JU47Zv8dYAGOAWnxVTv-NWRXAx9s4JTmUJU07wHFT67zaiAPG32upxzSYnSiKIM6O3YI79ZGti7V-QdCWRtiBxOjLh3oMxNvzCcJgTTW-HQmmeQii1zDdP-GC1Rs0umn7xhevV0-PazdAun8gOm5P8Ld_gCw2UojSyXNKZKfmsqJPnt96XgISsJy9-_K81O2L5O-GDW2nxM7_C00lPjk0sF0iNqPQKNZAhVr0kk4TCoT4ePDBbBBUCUw6KfhxpkkhmUuo549OfnVRHweKCGYhEm5WE9nw-5khsn01oqKJxbv_y6P4BrO5DGw0QG7NfYwbUflAaNRV_ljL51KqrNoQV0AdEetiWauYmab1O_GjVvCOudxDs52JwrFXbWBbqEqxhU7qQ3TS--F13f/https%3A%2F%2Fbluemail.me> >>> On Jun 18, 2022, at 5:13 PM, Charles Mills >>> <charl...@mcn.org<mailto:charl...@mcn.org>> wrote: >>> >>> I always like the stories about the companies that are in the eighth year of >>> a three-year project to get off the mainframe. >>> >>> Enzo, my friend, you have just kicked the hornets' nest! You had better >>> duck, because the onslaught is coming. "The mainframe is [not] dead" is near >>> and dear to the hearts of IBM-MAINers. >>> >>> Yes, I think the consensus is that the mainframe has a future. IBM seems to >>> be focused mainly on the very largest shops, so the trend seems to be bigger >>> and bigger machines at fewer and fewer companies. But it is hard to envision >>> Bank of America balancing their checking accounts every day on an array of >>> Windows servers, in their datacenter or in the cloud. My reading of the tea >>> leaves -- I am not an insider -- is that for a long time IBM was *saying* >>> the mainframe was here to stay but internally they did not believe it and >>> were not making decisions on that basis -- but I think that has now changed. >>> IBM appears to have made a HUGE investment in the z16, an investment that >>> will take more than 5 or more years to recoup. >>> >>> Welcome aboard! >>> >>> Charles >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On >>> Behalf Of Enzo D'Amato >>> Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2022 1:56 PM >>> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU >>> Subject: Re: Modernize Mainframe Applications for Hybrid Cloud with IBM and >>> AWS >>> >>> As someone who is new to this field, and hasn't been though a wave of "the >>> mainframe is going away" yet, will there still be companies running the >>> mainframe 5 or 10 years down the line? Also, when I read about companies >>> trying to get off of the mainframe, how often do these efforts end up >>> succeeding? >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> on behalf of >>> Mike Schwab <mike.a.sch...@gmail.com> >>> Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2022 12:04 AM >>> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU >>> Subject: Re: Modernize Mainframe Applications for Hybrid Cloud with IBM and >>> AWS >>> >>> Moshix signed up for an AWS instance, loaded up Hercules and Turnkey >>> 4-, got it going, and allowed some other people to log in. >>> >>> On Fri, Jun 17, 2022 at 8:31 AM Bill Johnson >>> <00000047540adefe-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote: >>> >>> Cloud - Something the mainframe has been doing for decades. We called >>>it >>> outsourcing. GM ran their entire organization out of mainframes in >>> Charlotte, Dallas, & perhaps another in the 80's. The internet just made it >>> easier, and less secure & reliable. Brought outsourcing to a wider audience. >>> >>> Mainframe modernization. An oxymoron. Like saying today's cars are like >>> cars from 50 years ago. The mainframe is more advanced than any other >>> platforms. Billions of dollars of investment and patented technologies have >>> guaranteed its place for decades to come. >>> >>> Sure, AWS, Azure, Oracle cloud & numerous others are creating cheap, >>> unsecured, unreliable, platforms for small businesses, picture storage, >>> emails, instant messaging, and many other tasks that aren't show stoppers if >>> they're hacked or down for one of many reasons. As Capital One found out and >>> lost almost 200 million for the pleasure. >>> >>> I enjoy the glee that many of you exude when IBM has what might be >>> perceived as negative news. I saw the same glee when in the 90's some idiot >>> said the mainframe would be history circa 2000. >>> >>> >>> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone >>> >>> >>> On Friday, June 17, 2022, 9:06 AM, zMan <zedgarhoo...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> On Fri, Jun 17, 2022 at 5:50 AM David Crayford <dcrayf...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>> Maybe it's the case that customers don't want to use IBMs cloud. Where >>>I >>> live in Australia the big four banks are moving significant chunks of >>> their infrastructure to public cloud and have government legislation to >>> do so. NAB in particular have been quite aggressive, although like most >>> sensible enterprises they have gone down the multi-cloud route with >>> Microsoft Azure so they don't have all their eggs in one basket. >>> >>> It will be interesting to see if IBM can close the cloud gap. Playing >>> catch-up is difficult when competing with behemoths with a decade+ head >>> start. >>> >>> >>> Indeed. Word from insiders is that since IBM "management" have decided >>> cloud is The Answer, folks have started playing games, like attributing >>> all >>> CICS-related revenue as "cloud". Q4 2020, IBM claimed $6.2B in cloud >>> revenue on total revenue of $16B. Given that nobody EVER says"cloud" >>>and >>> "IBM" in the same sentence in the real world, those numbers are quite >>> difficult to believe without this kind of gameplaying. >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, >>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, >>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA >>> Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, >>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, >>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, >>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, >>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, >> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, >> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
