Some part of David Crayford's problem here is that he does not talk like---and almost certainly does not want to talk like---a mainframer.
I am reminded of the verses in the Book of Judges: 12, 4 Then Jephthah gathered together all the men of Gilead, and fought with Ephraim: and the men of Gilead smote Ephraim, because they said, Ye Gileadites are fugitives of Ephraim among the Ephraimites, and among the Manassites. 5 And the Gileadites took the passages of Jordan before the Ephraimites: and it was so, that when those Ephraimites which were escaped said, Let me go over; that the men of Gilead said unto him, art thou an Ephraimite? If he say Nay; 6 Then said they unto him, Say now Shibboleth: and he said Sibboleth: for he could not frame to pronounce it right. Then they took him, and slew him at the passages of Jordan: and there fell at that time of the Ephraimites forty and two thousand. David is of course in no danger of being slain here; but he does need to practice his 'sh's. Even after he has done so some substantive differences will remain. In particular, the mainframe community's notions of what constitutes adequate reliability and availability are more exigent, much more exigent, than those of the open-source community. This difference comes close to being visceral; and it will only be bridged, if at all, by patient and careful discussion. Dismissiveness---It is common on both sides of this divide---will not not advance matters. John Gilmore, Ashland, MA 01721 - USA ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [email protected] with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
