1. The article I referenced explains WHY the original sender's email address appears in the messages that everyone receives, and that there is no way to "hide" it, at least not within the scope of an iMail setting. See item FOUR below for more.
2. NO, I did *not* mean "not being able to NOT include it (the trailer text)". I meant exactly what I said -- if I create a trailer, the manual says it will NOT appear at the bottom of messages that are delivered to accounts ON the iMail server. The trailer also does not appear in HTML messages, for the obvious reasons I was already aware of (it would have to be inserted before the ending HTML tags of an HTML message). My frustration lies in the fact that this so called "freebie" (which is promoted in the sales materials for iMail) feature has so many restrictions... can't use with HTML, can't expect it to show up at the bottom of messages delivered to local accounts (which is what an IpSwitch manual said -- I will test this again to see for myself). Bottom line, I need a way to include text at the bottom of ALL list messages, regardless of format or location of the destination mail accounts... That's what I am asking for. If it means having the list server strip HTML tags first, or if it means having the list server "know" how to place my requested trailer at the bottom of an incoming HTML message, or if it means I create TWO trailers -- one in plain text, the other in HTML... with this mature a product, I don't think it's too much to ask in a current or near-future release. And if this is not something that the "majority" of list servers support (I don't care about the majority, I care about the one I purchased, which says it supports trailers), this appears to be an opportunity for IpSwitch to offer something the others don't. HTML/Rich Text messages are a fact of life, and more to the point are implemented features by MANY internet users, and server products should keep up with that. 3. Being a good citizen has little to do with whether or not one sends an email message in plain text or HTML. Yes, I fully understand that HTML has higher overhead, but you're burying your head in the sand if you think that this sometimes useful way of transmitting well-formatted messages (how about tables that some users wish to present in their messages, without having to do an attachment? An attachment typically has more overhead than an HTML message that serves the same purpose. How about automatically generated HTML invoices? etc. etc.) doesn't have it's place, even on a listserv. You don't know my users, you don't know our particular use of the list, and so it stands to reason that you shouldn't pass judgement on the "good citizenship" of our users. We don't even USE digest mode on the list in question, and HTML messages are useful part of what we are doing -- plus, it's user-friendly, and I don't have to train a bunch of users (and remind them like a mother hen) on how to turn off HTML in their mail programs JUST for our list. Rejecting HTML messages is not an option, nor do we wish to. Please -- don't beat the HTML vs. Text message drum around me... it's an elitist, irrelevant argument; each format most certainly has its place online, even on mailing lists. I will try in the future to respect this list's requests for plain-text messages. 4. My claim that list member's email addresses are NOT private (in other words, any list member can discover the email addresses of all other list members on a MODERATED, "PRIVATE" list) is not an "allegation", it's a tested frickin' fact. I have a moderated list on my iMail server. It is marked "private" (it disallows subscriptions). I can send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED], with "list LISTNAME" in the body of the message, and I'll get back a list of all that list's member's email addresses -- JUST LIKE THE MANUAL SAYS -- even if I check the box on the list's "SECURITY" tab (the name of the tab prompting me to believe I can secure the list, including members addresses... silly me) labeled "Disable List Command". Sandy, I HAVE tested this -- the email addresses are available to all list members who know how to issue that command via email, even with the checkbox checked on a moderated, Private List (that checkbox is also checked). In addition, the article I mentioned also demonstrates how list member email addresses can be discovered, just by reading the messages to the list using certain email clients. So, my claim stands -- there is no real way to secure or "hide" the email addresses of list members. What is so perplexing about wanting to keep list member's email addresses private, especially when they can be delivered in BULK to anyone who knows the LIST command? Can you say SPAM?? I am fully willing to admit that I could be missing a setting or misunderstanding existing settings... but please don't accuse me of not testing my claims before asking for assistance. Frankly, I consider the fact that the email addresses of all of a list's members is available using the LIST command, even with the "Disable LIST command" checkbox checked, somewhat of a security hole, if only to allow malicious list members to discover and use the available email addresses for SPAMMING purposes. The additional availability of a list member's email address through each post is a little less obvious, and does not occur with all mail readers, but could still be used in a similar way, albeit with a lot more harvesting work. It would almost seem better if the "reply to list" feature, when enabled, would remove the email address of the sender from the email before sending it out to the list, replacing anything containing the sender's email address in the header with the email address of the list. This would disallow members from replying to one another, and prevent them from discovering the email addresses of other list members. Perhaps you're right... I'm asking for some features in something that maybe the majority of you consider to be a "freebie" feature. But hell, this "freebie" IS a listed, marketed feature in the iMail sales materials (http://www.ipswitch.com/products/IMail_Server/listserver.html). I think that justifies my comments on above issues at least to some extent. By the way -- check the 6th bullet point of that features page... "Disable" should mean "Disable"!! Thanks for listening to my rant. > http://support.ipswitch.com/kb/IM-20000922-DM01.htm What on earth did you find in there that's relevant to your questions? > This trailer feature for the iMail list server is practically > useless -- not being able to include it at the bottom of all > messages sent to local accounts makes NO sense at all Did you mean "not being able to NOT include it"? I have to say, this missing advanced feature is also missing from the majority of list managers out there, so it makes its own kind of sense. Or did you mean something else, like the global trailer.txt feature (which isn't part of IMAILSRV)--this is, I agree, a strange implementation, but not in the same realm. > and if users are using HTML formatting (99% of our users do!), the > trailer won't appear. As Rod said, good citizens use plain-text for lists, which generate an explosive (no pun intended) amount of traffic and so must be treated especially delicately. If you can't convince them by moderator message alone, convince them by rejecting messages that have 'multipart-alternative' in the headers, etc. IMAILSRV is part of the MTA part of IMail, which does not speak HTML. True, it would be great if it did do this kind of tag-stripping thing on its own, but it is basically a "freebie" thrown in alongside more maintained modules. > What can be done to REALLY add a trailer, without all these silly > problems? This should have been fixed SO long ago... a trailer on > list messages should be a TRAILER under all circumstances. What > gives? To do this would require parsing the HTML to determine the insertion point. It could be done using any good text-manipulation language, even VBScript. > is there ANY way to secure the email addresses of list members? This is a perplexing, seemingly untested allegation you're making. You're not correct in saying that the LIST command is irrevocably enabled, although the docs are misleading on this point, making it seem like a loophole where there isn't one. -Sandy To Unsubscribe: http://www.ipswitch.com/support/mailing-lists.html List Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/imail_forum%40list.ipswitch.com/ Knowledge Base/FAQ: http://www.ipswitch.com/support/IMail/ To Unsubscribe: http://www.ipswitch.com/support/mailing-lists.html List Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/imail_forum%40list.ipswitch.com/ Knowledge Base/FAQ: http://www.ipswitch.com/support/IMail/
