Since we do not have an image of the fruits in this observation, we have to
sort it out on the basis of other features. Finally I got time to have a
closer look at Dinesh's Solena images, and go through the paper of Wilde &
Duyfjes. My summary is as follows:
S. amplexicaulis S.
umbellata
-----------------------------------------------------
Male peduncle: 1-2 cm 0-7 mm
Male bracts: absent or 1-2 mm, 1-2 mm long,
falling off
persistent
Flower size: 3-4 mm 3-5 mm
Flower-stalk: 2-5 mm 2-8 mm
-----------------------------------------------------
1. Flower-clusters of Dinesh's plant are clearly stalkless. In S.
amplexicaulis they are 1-2 cm - much longer than the flower length of 3-4
mm.
2. In S. amplexicaulis the bracts are absent or fall off. Dinesh's plant
does show bracts.
3. My earlier comment regarding flowers being mostly hairless in S.
amplexicaulis is irrelevant because in these flowers the sepal-cup covers
most of the flower, with only the tiny petals peeping out at the tip.
By virtue of stalkless flower-clusters and persistent bracts, I think
Dinesh's plant should be Solena umbellata. Garg ji already thought it was
likely to be S. umbellata.
Tabish
-------------------------------------------
<http://www.flowersofindia.net>www.flowersofindia.net
The waterhole of flower lovers
On Fri, Sep 20, 2024 at 10:23 AM J.M. Garg <[email protected]> wrote:
> I just saw the fruit image of Kasim ji added on the page (
> https://www.flowersofindia.net/catalog/slides/Creeping%20Cucumber.html),
> while Dinesh ji's images remain the same (which is most likely to be
> S.umbellata). So it is better if, even the images of leaves and immature
> fruits are put on the FOI page, deleting Dinesh ji's images.
>
> On Sun, 15 Sept 2024 at 10:37, J.M. Garg <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> I still see the same images.
>> I don't agree with the id. Pl. see
>> https://efloraofindia.com/2016/02/17/solena-amplexicaulis/ (only one
>> observation so far in our site- see the typical fruit). (Distribution is
>> restricted to Tamilnadu, Karnataka and Kerala only).
>> We should keep these images as
>> https://efloraofindia.com/2016/07/26/solena-umbellata/ only.
>>
>>
>> On Sat, 14 Sept 2024 at 21:08, Tabish <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks Dinesh and Garg ji,
>>> I updated the fruit image on FOI:
>>> https://www.flowersofindia.net/catalog/slides/Creeping%20Cucumber.html
>>> PS: You may still see the old image from your browser cache unless it is
>>> refreshed.
>>> Tabish
>>> -------------------------------------------
>>> <http://www.flowersofindia.net>www.flowersofindia.net
>>> The waterhole of flower lovers
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Sep 14, 2024 at 5:06 PM J.M. Garg <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> "The first two photos showing flowers belong to observation dtd. July
>>>> 11, 2010, ...will revise the ID to S. amplexicaulis."- *Difficult to
>>>> say without fruits. *Only one observation so far in efi as per
>>>> https://efloraofindia.com/2016/02/17/solena-amplexicaulis/ (Also it is
>>>> found in Tamil Nadu, Karnataka, Kerala as per
>>>> https://phytokeys.pensoft.net/article/1454/)
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, 14 Sept 2024 at 16:57, Dinesh Valke <[email protected]>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Thanks, Garg ji for attaching the publication; thanks Tabish for
>>>>> resurfacing the old post.
>>>>>
>>>>> The first two photos showing flowers belong to observation dtd. July
>>>>> 11, 2010 <https://www.inaturalist.org/observations/81422504>, ...will
>>>>> revise the ID to *S. amplexicaulis*.
>>>>>
>>>>> ... while the one showing the ridged fruit belongs to another,observation
>>>>> of July 14, 2012 <https://www.inaturalist.org/observations/82402619>
>>>>> which by now has been validated as *Solena heterophylla* by Prof. Dr.
>>>>> Hanno Schaefer and Radha Veach. Going through the publication attached by
>>>>> Garg ji does tell me that it ought to be *Solena umbellata*.
>>>>>
>>>>> As of now, I do have one validated observation of *Solena umbellata*
>>>>> <https://www.inaturalist.org/observations/220455107>.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards.
>>>>> Dinesh
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Sep 14, 2024 at 3:48 PM J.M. Garg <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Going by the fruit shape it should be
>>>>>> https://efloraofindia.com/2016/07/26/solena-umbellata/
>>>>>> Fruit shape is different in
>>>>>> https://efloraofindia.com/2016/02/17/solena-amplexicaulis/
>>>>>> Pl. see attached publication for fruit shapes.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, 7 Sept 2024 at 11:57, Tabish <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dear Garg ji,
>>>>>>> Coming back to this old thread, I had made the correction back
>>>>>>> then.
>>>>>>> However, just wanted to point out that the abstract of the paper you
>>>>>>> pointed out, says:
>>>>>>> "The genus Solena Lour. is redefined, and its 3 species and 1
>>>>>>> subspecies are keyed out and described:
>>>>>>> S. amplexicaulis occurs in S India, S. heterophylla, with 2
>>>>>>> subspecies is widespread, but does not
>>>>>>> occur in S India ..."
>>>>>>> Based on this, Dinesh's images from Maharashtra
>>>>>>> <https://www.flickr.com/photos/dinesh_valke/4789737927>, which are
>>>>>>> also on FOI
>>>>>>> <https://www.flowersofindia.net/catalog/slides/Creeping%20Cucumber.html>,
>>>>>>> should belong to *Solena amplexicaulis*.
>>>>>>> Tabish
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
>>>>>>> From: J.M. Garg <Unknown>
>>>>>>> Date: Tuesday, July 26, 2016 at 5:19:38 PM UTC+5:30
>>>>>>> Subject: Images of Solena amplexicaulis in FOI should be of Solena
>>>>>>> heterophylla Lour.
>>>>>>> To: Flowers of India <Unknown>
>>>>>>> Cc: efloraofindia <Unknown>, Dinesh Valke <Unknown>, Thingnam
>>>>>>> Girija <Unknown>, Tabish Qureshi <Unknown>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi, Tabish ji,
>>>>>>> Images of Solena amplexicaulis in FOI
>>>>>>> <http://www.flowersofindia.net/catalog/slides/Creeping%20Cucumber.html>
>>>>>>> should be of Solena heterophylla Lour.
>>>>>>> as per *Solena heterophylla* Lour.
>>>>>>> <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/species/a---l/cl/cucurbitaceae/solena/solena-heterophylla-1>
>>>>>>> &
>>>>>>> as per comparative images at Solena
>>>>>>> <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/species/a---l/cl/cucurbitaceae/solena>
>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>> efi based on the following:
>>>>>>> REVIEW OF THE GENUS SOLENA (CUCURBITACEAE)
>>>>>>> <http://repository.naturalis.nl/document/566363>- W.J.J.O. DE
>>>>>>> WILDE & B.E.E. DUYFJES- BLUMEA 49: 69–81 (2004)
>>>>>>> The Cucurbitaceae of India
>>>>>>> <http://www.umsl.edu/~renners/Renner_Pandey_Indian_cucs_2013.pdf>:
>>>>>>> Accepted names, synonyms, geographic distribution, and information on
>>>>>>> images and DNA sequences by Susanne S. Renner, Arun K. Pandey. (2013)
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> With regards,
>>>>>>> J.M.Garg
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna'
>>>>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jmgarg1>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Winner of Wipro-NFS Sparrow Awards 2014 for efloraofindia
>>>>>>> <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/award-for-efloraofindia>
>>>>>>> .
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For identification, learning, discussion & documentation of Indian
>>>>>>> Flora, please visit/ join our Efloraofindia Google e-group
>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/indiantreepix> (largest in
>>>>>>> the world- around 2700 members & 2,40,000 messages on 31.3.16) or
>>>>>>> Efloraofindia
>>>>>>> website <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/> (with a
>>>>>>> species database of more than 11,000 species & 2,20,000 images).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The whole world uses my Image Resource
>>>>>>> <http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:J.M.Garg> of more than
>>>>>>> a thousand species & eight thousand images of Birds, Butterflies, Plants
>>>>>>> etc. (arranged alphabetically & place-wise). You can also use them for
>>>>>>> free
>>>>>>> as per Creative Commons license attached with each image.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also author of 'A Photoguide to the Birds of Kolkata & Common Birds
>>>>>>> of India'.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
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>>>>>>> .
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> With regards,
>>>>>> J.M.Garg
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> With regards,
>>>> J.M.Garg
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> With regards,
>> J.M.Garg
>>
>
>
> --
> With regards,
> J.M.Garg
>
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