Mark, why to exempt un unborn , but capable of surviving on its own outside the
womb fetus, from the other laws dealing with murder?
You must agree, that even the most libertarian society will have to have some
laws protecting citizens from crimes , such as murder or theft.
[and prisons too]. The only acceptable justification has been always a self
defense argument or an accident.
If mother's life is endangered by her pregnancy, sure- she should be allowed
to kill her baby at any time. But, allowing to abort 6 month old fetuses
because a person refuses responsibility, is akin to a permission to commit a
crime.
To solve this situation, there would have to be special homes for pregnant
women, especially if they decide to give their babies later for adoption. This
is of course, a social program. But for a health of society, I think important.
You may of course believe, that it would require a forceful donation from you,
and is contrary to your ideology. But then, how would you propose to solve the
problem of late term abortions and killing of unwanted babies after the birth?
It would be allowed, or?
Anna
----- Original Message -----
From: mark robert
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2005 10:17 PM
Subject: RE: objective vs subjective Re: [Libertarian] Re:
Socialism/Capitalism of the Author
Anna,
You seem to imply that abortion prohibition would be a move away
from barbarism and toward civility. Surely you realize that all
changes in society have not been a move in that direction.
Including abortion prohibition along side obvious civil
advancements is only a transparent attempt to color it white.
Consider how abortion prohibition would be a move TOWARD
barbarism. WHAT IF society decides to give the unborn the same
rights as born persons? THEN it's not only appropriate to
jail/execute a mother for aborting, but also for treating her own
body with anything less than perfect health. A mother could be
charged with the crime of violating the "rights" of her unborn
("child" abuse) by engaging in any behavior that is less than
perfectly healthy. After all, she is "forcing" "harm" on a
non-consenting other. The only way to insure that the rights of
the unborn are not going to be violated is to put 24/7
surveillance on every pregnant woman. Maybe she goes past-due and
the doc decides the baby wants out and she is not pushing hard
enough. Will she be charged with illegal confinement? I could
predict maybe a few dozen other new and exciting offenses against
the rights of the unborn that prosecutors would be able to
pursue. If you think I'm exaggerating the length of the
government's strong arm, where have you been? Show me a law the
gov has NOT abused with over-enforcement. Give gov an inch and
they ALWAYS take the mile. Do you realize the ramifications of
this new prohibition?
As Phil Donahue used to ask: "is this the kind of world you
want"? Give fetuses "individual" rights and you end up with a
horribly barbaric future. All "pro-life" women should be very
careful what they ask for - in case they might get it. Society
either allows mothers to abort millions of unborns OR jails/kills
millions of women. I have to admit, I am partial to women.
-Mark
_____
Abortions have been with us always. There is a whole ancient
pharmacopeia of plants used for abortion that Egyptians had.
The laws preventing abortion are relatively new. So, we can talk
about the phenomena as it was when unregulated. The art of
disposing of unwanted babies has been always with us in addition
to such other options such as throwing a newborn from a high
rock into a sea.
Eventually, when human consciousness was able to achieve the
point in time when it became less barbaric and more aware of
suffering of others besides themselves; of existence of a psyche
and consciousness itself [ Jung not long ago, in 1950' and
previously Fraud] laws were created first to prevent slavery,
then to prevent abuse of children and eventually of the unborn.
Not long ago, parents were still allowed to kill their own
children for any act of disobedience. In the 19th century
England, 4 years old children were used as chimney sweepers dying
often before the age of 8 of tuberculosis or other lung
disease. The child slavery still continues with us being
present in many countries, and children as young as 5 sold are
into prostitution.
This alone shows you, that under liberal conditions, people not
necessary act better. Many laws followed the realization that we
cannot count on humans to be righteous. Nevertheless, if you
make just one NO HARM law, everything else will be covered and
at the same time, you will educate people because you will force
them to think what is what.
Anna
_____
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
ForumWebSiteAt http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Libertarian
SPONSORED LINKS E government Libertarian E government strategy
Libertarian party E government procurement
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
a.. Visit your group "Libertarian" on the web.
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~-->
Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page
http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/KlSolB/TM
--------------------------------------------------------------------~->
ForumWebSiteAt http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Libertarian
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Libertarian/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
