Not everyone blowing themselves up are Taliban / Al Qaeda. I guess from your view - its more courageous to drop a US supplied bomb from high on an innocent family by mistake? Surely thats more valiant?
----- Original Message ----- From: Bob Giramma To: [email protected] Sent: Wednesday, June 11, 2008 7:44 PM Subject: Re: [Libertarian] Stop the War FOR Terror The "guys blowing themselves up" do not fight for freedom. Unless you know something about the Taliban/al Qaeda libertarian credentials I have not yet read. From: Peter Sent: Wednesday, June 11, 2008 11:28 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [Libertarian] Stop the War FOR Terror " I cheer for freedom-loving Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan, too." Except when the argument is against American invaders, or they are of Arab descent. Because those guys blowing themselves up at checkpoints - they are fighting for their freedom, they want occupying forces out of their country. ----- Original Message ----- From: Bob Giramma To: [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2008 6:26 PM Subject: Re: [Libertarian] Stop the War FOR Terror No, the US wouldn't need to invade Canada to pursue Hezbollah after your hypothetical attack. You see, Canada is a civilized and free nation. They honor the rule of law and adhere to international agreements. As such, they would pursue Hezbollah themselves, perhaps asking for US cooperation. That situation between two free and civilized nations doesn't exist in the Middle East. Israel must resort to war, since diplomacy with Arabs nearly always fails. Yes, I cheer for Israel. In any circumstance with free people on one side and authoritarian savages on the other, I make the libertarian choice of cheering for freedom. It has nothing to do with religion. I am not a Jew, and the holy land means nothing to me. I cheer for freedom-loving Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan, too. From: Steve Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2008 12:22 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [Libertarian] Stop the War FOR Terror So if Hesbollah crossed the Canadian border and launched attacks in the US, then we should retaliate against Canada? Bob, it seems that it doesn't matter what Israel does or who they kill or how they justify it, you continue to cheer! That is, I believe, a direct result of a Christian bias (Israel is the bible god's chosen people and can do no wrong) and has nothing to do with the merits of what Israel does. Steve Bob Giramma wrote: > > > AFAIK, Hezbollah had crossed over into Israel and launched missiles at > it before Israel invaded Lebanon in pursuit. > > From: Peter > Sent: Monday, June 09, 2008 4:46 PM > To: [email protected] <mailto:Libertarian%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: [Libertarian] Stop the War FOR Terror > > They dont have to stop defending themselves - but if they would stop > being the schoolyard bully and going on the offensive it would be a big > step. > > Or do you think invading and nearly destroying another country is > justified for 2 kidnapped soldiers? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Bob Giramma > To: [email protected] <mailto:Libertarian%40yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Monday, June 09, 2008 2:05 PM > Subject: Re: [Libertarian] Stop the War FOR Terror > > You're right. The Israelis should just stop fighting and let the Arab > savages slaughter them. > > Then there will be all that peace, freedom, and prosperity that > primitive peoples are so good at. > > From: Peter > Sent: Monday, June 09, 2008 9:47 AM > To: [email protected] <mailto:Libertarian%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: [Libertarian] Stop the War FOR Terror > > "I read elsewhere the US loses many points for its quasi-police state > policies associated with the wars" > > No the freedom index I believe has to do with inside the borders. But > I'd look closer to your home, Patriot Act, RICO, Draconian drug laws. > Should I go on? > > "Israel would be ranked far higher if they didn't have war imposed on > them every day of their existence" > > Much of this war is their own making. Especialy in recent years, even > many Israelis are speaking out about this and its caused a lot of > political splits. > > "Switzerland is fortunate to be surrounded by advanced and civilized > people these days, making freedom a lot easier" > > You are distracting again. I mean after all, your right. The US and > Canada are such ominous neighbors. And surely the UK has nasty neighbors.... > > Bordering countries has little to do with the index at all, except maybe > in cases like Israel, but again much of that is self brought. They treat > the Palestinians like sub humans with US weapons. Ie they drop bombs and > rockets all the time in Palestine and often kill whole familes of > innocents, but how dare a Palestinian fight back with a bomb on > themselves - then the Israelis cry foul. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Bob Giramma > To: [email protected] <mailto:Libertarian%40yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Monday, June 09, 2008 1:27 AM > Subject: Re: [Libertarian] Stop the War FOR Terror > > I read elsewhere the US loses many points for its quasi-police state > policies associated with the wars. That's typical of all nations at war, > as they tighten up security in response to threats -- both real and > perceived. For example, Israel would be ranked far higher if they didn't > have war imposed on them every day of their existence. Switzerland is > fortunate to be surrounded by advanced and civilized people these days, > making freedom a lot easier. > > From: Peter > Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2008 6:36 PM > To: [email protected] <mailto:Libertarian%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: [Libertarian] Stop the War FOR Terror > > And if you look at the Indiividual Freedom rank, US is down at 19.... > and several are tied at higher levels, so its 19th rank, not even 19th > country. Not very imporessive! > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Bob Giramma > To: [email protected] <mailto:Libertarian%40yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2008 1:57 PM > Subject: Re: [Libertarian] Stop the War FOR Terror > > It looks like the US does quite well in the liberty rankings: > http://www.stateofworldliberty.org/report/rankings.html > <http://www.stateofworldliberty.org/report/rankings.html> > http://www.freetheworld.com/ef_map.html > <http://www.freetheworld.com/ef_map.html> > > The Middle East Muslim nations, not so well. > > Switzerland has conscription military service. > > From: Peter > Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2008 8:13 AM > To: [email protected] <mailto:Libertarian%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: [Libertarian] Stop the War FOR Terror > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Bob Giramma > To: [email protected] <mailto:Libertarian%40yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2008 9:42 PM > Subject: Re: [Libertarian] Stop the War FOR Terror > > Yeah, Patriot act... Not to mention how foreigners are treated. > Guantanamo Bay? Waterboarding? Need I go on? You are looking through > some very heavily fogged glasses here. Look at freedom rankings etc. The > US not only is not at the top, but is going down the list in recent > years. You should be looking at Switzerland and others instead. -- Steve - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Take World's Smallest Political Quiz at http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html "If a thousand old beliefs were ruined on our march to truth we must still march on." --Stopford Brooke [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Beauty School Programs - Get the career you've always wanted. Click Now. http://ads.lavabit.com/fc/Ioyw6kddoJCmzcGJ5krH3nAUB18A8LQ196w8080A4SzitGB8g164jB/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] It's never been easier to change your name. 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