Linux-Advocacy Digest #585, Volume #32 Thu, 1 Mar 01 18:13:08 EST
Contents:
Re: What the hell is MS thinking? ("phil")
Re: MS websites: a tale of total and humiliating failure! ("Ayende Rahien")
Re: Something Seemingly Simple. (Kaz Kylheku)
Re: Windows Owns Desktop, Extends Lead in Server Market (Karel Jansens)
Re: KDE or DOJ ? (Karel Jansens)
Re: KDE or DOJ ? (Bob Hauck)
Re: Something Seemingly Simple. ("Edward Rosten")
Re: NT vs *nix performance (Aaron Kulkis)
Re: NT vs *nix performance (Aaron Kulkis)
Re: [OT] .sig (Aaron Kulkis)
Re: [OT] .sig (was: Something Seemingly Simple.) (Aaron Kulkis)
Re: NT vs *nix performance ("Edward Rosten")
Re: Mircosoft Tax (Bob Hauck)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "phil" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: What the hell is MS thinking?
Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 21:50:46 GMT
We do for a few reasons:
- It's consistent with the desktop version of Windows (W2K pro). This makes
it nice for our developers who use W2k pro for there development machine.
- Our developers do a lot of VB work and this carries over very nicely to
doing server side applications.
- We run server-side apps that are only available on W2k, such as fax/image
recognition.
- We find more people with experience in W2k than Linux. And they cost us
less.
Probably a few more reasons I can't think of right now. But the reliability
has been exceptional. A particular set of three W2K servers we operate have
been running for 5 months straight without incident and handle heavy web,
email, streaming and other processing loads.
Phil
--
"Johannes Bauer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Why the hell do sysadmins use Win2k on their servers? What do I need a
> GUI for to have a great server machine? What do I need pretty icons
> and plug & play and all that crap for?
>
> Windows is just the instable version of Linux for users who are too
> dumb to handle the real thing.
------------------------------
From: "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: MS websites: a tale of total and humiliating failure!
Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 23:48:12 +0200
"." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Besides, MS doesn't have a huge incentive to migrate these sites since
> > they're working right now. They don't have time or money to spend just
> > to make morons like you shut up.
>
> Irrespective of whether the guy really is a moron or not (I doubt it), MS
> most certainly do have the money to spend to make us shut up, but until
> they care more about making their products acceptable than they do about
> increasing their megaprofits, I don't think anyone's going to be shutting
> up.
No, they don't have any reason to change it.
It is working? Stick with it.
You don't waste money where you don't need to.
And replacing a working system just for the sake of replacing it is stupidly
wasting money.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kaz Kylheku)
Crossposted-To: comp.lang.c
Subject: Re: Something Seemingly Simple.
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 21:50:16 GMT
On Thu, 01 Mar 2001 00:20:47 +0000, Edward Rosten <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Kaz Kylheku"
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 18:14:00 -0500, Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>>Can I, or can I not write my own printf() which behaves utterly and
>>>completely differently than the printf() in the standard library?
>>>
>>>a) no B) YES.
>>
>> You cannot define your own printf name with external linkage.
>
>You can if you're not linking against the standard library.
There is nothing in the C standard which indicates that C program may
elect not to link against the library, there is no portable way to do
so. If you find a way to do that, you are no longer operating your
tools as a conforming, hosted C language implementation.
>However the
>compiler reserves the right to mung all library functions, so you can
>expect undefined behaviour even if you define printf as static.
Sorry no, read the standard. The name printf is reserved for external
linkage always, and as a filescope identifier or function-like macro
name when <stdio.h> is included. So it is possible to use the
identifier as the name for an object or function with internal linkage.
Simply do not include <stdio.h> in that translation unit.
------------------------------
From: Karel Jansens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Windows Owns Desktop, Extends Lead in Server Market
Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 21:10:13 +0100
al wrote:
> It bugs you to see the almighty Linux being pushed away by Windows,
> doesn't ti ?
> And don't forget 2000 was the worst MS's year and the best Linux's year
> and they still didn't make
> any inroads.
> So what will happen when MS releases .NET, Visual Studio.NET, Windows XP,
> Office XP,
> XBOX, ... this year ? Their market share will be even higher.
>
Who cares?
You're the weakest link, goodbye.
--
Regards,
Karel Jansens
]]] "Go go gadget linux!" Zzzooommm!! [[[
------------------------------
From: Karel Jansens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: KDE or DOJ ?
Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 21:45:05 +0100
Roberto Alsina wrote:
>
> One review called the changes "akin to those between windows 95 and 98".
>
There are /changes/ between Windows 95 and 98??!!!
Like, oh wow...
--
Regards,
Karel Jansens
]]] "Go go gadget linux!" Zzzooommm!! [[[
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Hauck)
Subject: Re: KDE or DOJ ?
Reply-To: hauck[at]codem{dot}com
Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 21:59:46 GMT
On Thu, 1 Mar 2001 11:49:49 -0300, Roberto Alsina <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>> spent days trying to add panels in Mandrake 7.2, and they wouldn't
>> appear. I thought maybe I had to restart KDE for them to be visible,
>> but no go.
>But anyway, what do you mean by "adding extra panels"?
I think he means adding menu items to the K menu. This works fine for
me in KDE 2.0.1 as long as I am adding them only for myself. If I drop
a new desktop file in /opt/kde2/share/applnk it often won't appear for
some users until I delete ~/.kde2/share/config/ksycoca. There seems to
be a bug in the way KDE determines whether it needs to reread menus.
IIRC, when I checked someone had reported this already.
--
-| Bob Hauck
-| Codem Systems, Inc.
-| http://www.codem.com/
------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.lang.c
Subject: Re: Something Seemingly Simple.
Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 22:05:23 +0000
> But can you name-clash with it? Is that something that has to work? If
I don't think you can. Since the compiler might `know' abut library
functions, it can do clever substitutions such as:
printf("...");
might be changed to
puts("...");
and (as suggested by someone earlier)
printf("%i", integer);
might be changed to
__stdio_output_int(integer);
or whatever.
You can't guarntee that your function will be called predictibaly.
> you write a kernel version of printf, don't you still have to call it
> something different, like "kprintf", for example.
yup.
-Ed
--
| u98ejr
| @
Share, and enjoy. | eng.ox
| .ac.uk
------------------------------
From: Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: NT vs *nix performance
Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 17:06:11 -0500
JS PL wrote:
>
> "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:97m59m$sa9$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "JS PL" <js@plcom> wrote:
> >
> > > Say it aint so. You mean people can change their OS even if Windows is
> > > pre-installed?? Doesn't that fly in the face of the (failed) "monopoly"
> > > courtroom competition strategy that Microsoft's competition was banking
> > > on?
> >
> > Absoloutely not! Whether they use windows or not they STILL have to pay
> > for it. How could anything *but* a monopoly manage to enforce that?
>
> And whether they use the other 1gb of apps that also get put into the master
> disk of their OEM system they still pay for them. I don't see anyone whining
> about being forced to pay for any other software the system comes with the
> system.
Your failure to listen doesn't nullify the complaints...
> That's the biggest complaint I ever hear from people is, how do I
> get rid of all this junk that came with my computer?? Half of it doesn't
This is because you hang out with brain-dead sheep.
> even show up in appwiz.cpl to get removed. If and OEM disk of Win98 costs
> $40.00 per unit but a basic set of apps ups the price of same disk to
> $80.00, who's whining about the additional 40 bucks for encyclopedia ect...
> Last time I heard Best Buy charged the same whether or not you took the
> million apps home with the system.
>
> Go on down to best buy, pick out a computer and ask what discount you get if
> you use your own copy of Quicken Lite.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shelala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,alt.linux.sux,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: NT vs *nix performance
Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 17:08:45 -0500
dabean wrote:
>
> "Aaron Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> >
> > Jon Johanson wrote:
> > >
> > > "Charlie Ebert" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > In article <3a97347b$0$2432$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Jan Johanson
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >"Charlie Ebert" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > > >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > ><snip good stuff>
> > > > >>
> > > > >> What I find hillarious about this is the author appearently
> > > > >> has never heard of HOT MAIL and how Microsoft has been trying
> > > > >> for the last decade to replace the FreeBSD servers which RUN
> > > > >> HOTMAIL with Windows counterparts.
> > > > >
> > > > >given that hotmail isn't a decade old we find our very first problem
> with
> > > > >this lie.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > It might not be exactly 10 years old. It's pretty close.
> > >
> > > Not quite.
> >
> > Even if Hotmail were less than a year old...the fact remains that
> > Mafia$oft has failed on TWO attempts to migrate it from Unix to
> > their shoddy products.
> >
>
> aaron which product?
>
One failed Unix -> NT (Neutered Technology) attempt
One failed Unix -> 2k (Lose 2000) attempt
> As last time I looked windows2000 server/advanced server DOES NOT have a
> built in webmail server.
>
> What you mean is that ms might have failed in migrating the hotmail front
> end application from unix to windows 2000.
All the more fucking pathetic, isn't it...
> Even their possible failure is not useful as reason why ms products are bad
> in general because until the hotmail code is avalaible as application that
> microsoft sell you can't say any other products from ms are bad because of
> it.
>
> Remeber any programmer can write a bad windows app just like any programmer
> can write a bad unix app.
> Any programmer can badly port a app from one platform to another.
But it takes something like Microsoft to tout something as a
"server"-grade operating system that can't perform as such for
something as trivial as being the front-end to a web-based mail app.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shelala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.lang.c
Subject: Re: [OT] .sig
Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 17:11:43 -0500
Richard Heathfield wrote:
>
> Aaron Kulkis wrote:
> >
> > Richard Heathfield wrote:
> > >
> > > Aaron Kulkis wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Michael Powe wrote:
> > > > >
> > >
> > > <snip>
> > >
> > > > > While it's deeply shaming to have such as Mr. Kulkis performing his
> > > > > routine as the "ugly American" before an international audience, I
> > >
> > > There is no need (writes this Englishman) for clueful Americans to feel
> > > such shame. Idiocy is a truly international phenomenon. Mr Kulkis
> > > happens to be an American idiot, but there are also plenty of
> > > non-American idiots to go round.
> >
> > You are mistaken
>
> You are claiming that Americans have a monopoly on idiocy?
False premise. I was talking about the other half of your
erroneous statement.
>
> >
> > Understanding one's rights is not idiocy.
>
> I didn't say it was. Read for comprehension.
Your failure to understand is not my problem.
>
> >
> > >
> > > > > would like to point out a couple things. First, we have no true
> > > > > knowledge that Mr. Kulkis ever served in the Armed Forces of the
> > > >
> > > > Check the records.
> > >
> > > I just checked the only record that counts in comp.lang.c - the ISO C
> > > Standard - and Mr Kulkis doesn't seem to be mentioned there, so I can
> > > only conclude that he's mistaken about his name appearing in the
> > > records.
> >
> > comp.lang.c keeps military service and mobilization records?
>
> Users are so cute.
Try systems engineer.
>
> No, of course comp.lang.c doesn't keep military service records. That
> was precisely the point I was making.
You failed to make any point, other than the irrelevance of your statements.
>
> --
> Richard Heathfield
> "Usenet is a strange place." - Dennis M Ritchie, 29 July 1999.
> C FAQ: http://www.eskimo.com/~scs/C-faq/top.html
> K&R Answers: http://users.powernet.co.uk/eton/kandr2/index.html
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shelala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.lang.c
Subject: Re: [OT] .sig (was: Something Seemingly Simple.)
Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 17:13:01 -0500
Kaz Kylheku wrote:
>
> On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 19:34:36 -0500, Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >
> >Mark McIntyre wrote:
> >>
> >> On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 13:15:19 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Lawrence
> >> Kirby) wrote:
> >>
> >> >In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Aaron Kulkis" writes:
> >> >
> >> >...
> >> >
> >> >>Complete bozos are not given security clearances nor allowed to even
> >> >>seeh, let alone use military code books.
> >>
> >> ROFL. Is Aaron asserting that field officers can't see codebooks,
> >> unless they're also smart? Sheesh !
> >
> >Do you know what it takes to become an officer these days?
>
> An 8th grade education, history of antisocial behavior, and a three
> foot long criminal record?
In the US Army, that's 2 reasons that will bar you from even being
able to enlist as a private.
Try again.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shelala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: NT vs *nix performance
Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 22:16:37 +0000
>> > Say it aint so. You mean people can change their OS even if Windows
>> > is pre-installed?? Doesn't that fly in the face of the (failed)
>> > "monopoly" courtroom competition strategy that Microsoft's
>> > competition was banking on?
>>
>> Absoloutely not! Whether they use windows or not they STILL have to pay
>> for it. How could anything *but* a monopoly manage to enforce that?
>
> And whether they use the other 1gb of apps that also get put into the
> master disk of their OEM system they still pay for them. I don't see
> anyone whining about being forced to pay for any other software the
> system comes with the system.
I quit buying computers from big retailers to avoid the Microsoft Tax
(forced Windows purchace). To be quite frany, most of the other apps that
they often force on the user aren't worth the disk space.
Anyway, this was in relation to thinkpads. What software do they come
with that you are forced to buy, with the exception of windows?
> That's the biggest complaint I ever hear
> from people is, how do I get rid of all this junk that came with my
> computer?? Half of it doesn't even show up in appwiz.cpl to get
removed.
> If and OEM disk of Win98 costs
> $40.00 per unit but a basic set of apps ups the price of same disk to
> $80.00, who's whining about the additional 40 bucks for encyclopedia
> ect...
Me. I stopped paying for all that crap.
> Last time I heard Best Buy charged the same whether or not you took the
> million apps home with the system.
I'll take your word for this.
> Go on down to best buy, pick out a computer and ask what discount you
> get if you use your own copy of Quicken Lite.
Microsoft isn't the only company out ther ripping off the comsumer. Seems
like Best Buy are too.
-ed
--
| u98ejr
| @
Share, and enjoy. | eng.ox
| .ac.uk
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Hauck)
Crossposted-To: alt.linux.sux,alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Mircosoft Tax
Reply-To: hauck[at]codem{dot}com
Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 22:17:12 GMT
On 1 Mar 2001 04:29:23 GMT, Donovan Rebbechi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>On Thu, 01 Mar 2001 00:43:46 GMT, Bob Hauck wrote:
>>Who, exactly, is Microsoft's competition for that OEM license?
>
>Linux distributions, and other OS licenses go for around the same price.
What is the Linux OEM price then? It isn't reasonable to compare the
OEM price of one thing and the retail price of another. What's the OEM
price of OS/2 or BeOS? To claim this you need to tell us what the
prices are.
>What I am doing is pointing out that game companies don't lower their
>prices just because they're doing well. And they're not obliged to
>do so.
And what I am doing is pointing out that in a free market it is market
conditions that determine what "fair" and "reasonable" mean. Anything
else is really just an arbitrary judgement.
>>I don't whine about the price of Windows, as I don't buy it. I do
>>observe that the retail price has been quite constant in spite of the
>>volume being much higher now than five or ten years ago. I can also
>
>My point is, so what ? The fact that they are succesful does not in any
>way oblige them to reduce their prices.
And I am *not* saying that. I am saying that you and I have no way of
knowing what the price "would be" in a fair and competitive market.
Maybe they could charge *more* for all I know. But in any case, your
saying that the price is "reasonable" is fine and dandy, but the price
has not been determined in the same way as prices of other products, so
comparisons are specious.
>>One could make a case that Windows is reasonably priced by some critera,
>>which is apparently what you are doing, but how do you decide what's
>>"reasonable" other thay via subjective things such as "I don't mind
>>paying that much".
>
>Compare it with the price of other operating systems. It's in the same
>ballpark.
Ok, there's some logic to that. But since those other operating systems
have such a tiny minority of the market, I can argue that Windows' price
is pretty much independent of what the other guys charge except at the
margins where the Windows fee becomes extortinate.
>> I think a case can be made that it could potentially
>>be cheaper if there were actual competition.
>
>$50- is already fairly cheap. I think you'd have a hard time making a
>case that the sales increase resulting from further reduction in price
>would justify the loss of per-sale revenue.
Perhaps. But we can't know that, can we? In fact, we don't even know
that $50 is the average price OEM's pay since OEM agreements are
typically under NDA.
All I wanted to do was point out that the "Linux zealots" aren't
entirely mistaken. The market has been distorted and we can't know what
the "fair" price really is. There's reason to think it could be lower.
--
-| Bob Hauck
-| Codem Systems, Inc.
-| http://www.codem.com/
------------------------------
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