On Sat, 4 Jun 2005, Peter wrote:
On Sat, 4 Jun 2005, Matan Ziv-Av wrote:
If it is an unmodified GPL version of well-known code like the kernel and
busybox then there is no need to provide the source since the binaries are
'stock'. You can d/l the source elsewhere.
It is best that you read the GPL, before you give opinions about it. The
license says nothing about "well-known code". If you commercially
distribute a binary created from a GPL source to someone, you must either
include a copy of the source (3a) or a written offer to provide the source
(3b).
Or you must make it available to the user on request. On your website, or
someone else's. And it IS available. The GPL does not say anywhere that the
Why do you invent something that is not written in the GPL? The only
provision in the GPL for distributing the program "in object code or
executable form" is in section 3. This section requires One of two
things - source included (including scripts used to build), Or written
promise to provide source.
distributor must provide a CS degree with hardware consultation and
assistance in building a complex aggregate hardware/software system. Nor a
script for automatic building. The code is out there, the datasheets are out
Did you actually read the GPL?
there, you can buy bare development boards (for ~$10k fyi), go get them and
do it yourself if you like.
What has that got to do with the GPL?
If they use proprietary programs then they are proprietary and that's
that, and it's legal, and they do not need to publish any source.
Only if the whole package is "mere aggregation" of the GPL and non-GPL
parts. It is quite clear that a kernel module is a derived work of the
kernel, and that the "module exception" from Linus does not cover modules
that are distributed together with the kernel bianry they are supposed to
run with.
No it is not. There are many examples of kernel modules that provide support
for modems, network drivers and other devices, which are NOT open source and
NOT 'aggregations'. If you don't want to make your 802.11g wireless card work
If the modules are distributed apart from the kernel itself (as is
usually the case for the modules you speak of), then Linus allows this.
Some other kernel specifically do not allow this, so anyone who
distributes such modules is at risk. For modules that come together with
the kernel, as is the case with the ECI router, this is not allowed by
Linus' exception, nor by anything else.
- don't use the modules! Suse, Red Hat and others regularly ship with such
modules in the distribution. Some graphics card drivers (like nvidia) are
notorious for this. Most 802.11g drivers available run the original (win32)
driver in an emulation because they are closed source.
And to top it all, you do not own the router, it is rented. So you are a
'user' and have no rights on the hardware or software in it, nor has anyone
So I can create copies of CDs I buy in the store, and "rent" them to
other people?
ECI do not have a right to "rent" Linux kernel or Busybox, except if
they follow the GPL, which they do not.
an obligation to show you, as a user, anything. It's nice enough they did not
hide the ssh, ftp and telnet interfaces, or alter the kernel /proc filesystem
to hide its origins. I.e. they repect the IP. Would you expect to be able to
see the source code of the interacting application in an ATM banking machine
if it runs linux inside ? Want to bet that qualified Bezeq service personnel
have manufacturer contacts and source access if they need it ?
Again, the distributor for the linux used in that box seems to be Monta
Vista. If you have a problem with the way it works or is distributed, write
to them. Url: http://www.mvista.com/. Kits are available from:
http://www.mvista.com/previewkit/ This is a commercial firm that provides
advanced linux development packages.
Monta Vista provides source with every binary of a GPL program that they
provide. What has that got to do with ECI?
What I can or can not find on the internet is irrelevant to the fact
that ECI have to do specific things if they want to distributes Linux or
Busybox, and the other fact, that they do not do those things.
Here are a couple of links on embedded linux:
http://lwn.net/Articles/17953/
Picture player ? Axis single chip embedded linux (is that *bundling*) or not
? Much more at linuxdevices.com . Just to cool you off: 1 dozen phones
powered by linux:
http://www.linuxdevices.com/articles/AT9423084269.html
I have no connection with ECI or Monta Vista.
Peter
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