Linux-Misc Digest #194, Volume #19 Fri, 26 Feb 99 21:13:14 EST
Contents:
Re: new kernel boot messages ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: FreeAgent for Linux (NF Stevens)
Re: Microkernels are an abstraction inversion (Barry Margolin)
Re: RealPlayer 5.0 on Kernel 2.2.2 (James Lewis)
Re: Best Free Unix? (why FreeBSD?) (brian moore)
Re: Best Free Unix? (why FreeBSD?) (Louis Epstein)
enlightenment ("Nick Warrington")
Re: Apache WEB server. (Yan Seiner)
process ID question (Gerald Willmann)
Re: Sound Blaster AWE 64 Gold (Michael Proto)
Re: digi board PC/Xe config is actually very simple! ("gc")
Re: Pentium III Boycott and survey info (Juergen Heinzl)
Anti-Virus for Linux ("Brian Donovan")
Re: ...a Linux RedHat Technician/Superuser ? (DanH)
Re: Linux g++ (Frank Hale)
digi board ("gc")
Re: Samba and Redhat 5.2 ("Rich Mycroft")
Re: linux commmands (David M. Cook)
Re: disk otpimization & defragmentat? ("D. Vrabel")
Re: Can Linux run on NT for stability? (David Kirkpatrick)
Re: Should IBM port Visual Age for Java to Linux? (Dennis Smith)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: new kernel boot messages
Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 23:08:33 GMT
On Fri, 26 Feb 1999 19:05:10 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
make mrproper
may fix this.
did you do a
make modules
make modules_install
>I have compiled a new kernel (Redhat 5.0, kernel 2.0.32) to add a couple of
>things I wanted to play with and take out all the other stuff I don't need. I
>only have a couple of drivers in there as modules. When the kernel boots and
>gets to the "checking module dependencies" part, about 100 messages scroll by
>of the form "/lib/modules/2.0.32/misc/ipx.o: unresolved symbol(s)". I think I
>know what this means but why is it happening? The kernel goes on to boot and
>everything seems to be working. Why is it looking to resolve symbols for all
>the modules which are not in the kernel configuration? Did I miss a step?
>
>-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
>http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (NF Stevens)
Subject: Re: FreeAgent for Linux
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 00:12:46 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rudy Taraschi) wrote:
>Hi folks,
>
>I want something that doesn't exist, FreeAgent for Linux. Believe it or
>not, it's the only reason I have Windoze95 still installed on my PC.
>(I've sent them an email asking for FreeAgent for Linux, if you're
>interested, maybe you should do the same and create some demand).
>
>Now here's my question. I still like using 'tin' to read news, but need
>to do my reading offline (ie, at home). Is there a 'news sucker' for
>Linux that will read in all the headers, allow me to wade through them
>and tag what I want, and inhale them onto my computer so I can use tin
>(or whatever) to read them later on? Thanks.
>
> rudy
You could try using wine (www.winehq.com). This program allows you
to run (some) windows executables on the X desktop. I've been using
it to run free agent for about six months without any real problems.
Note though that wine is still very much in development and is by
no means a finished product.
Norman
------------------------------
From: Barry Margolin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Microkernels are an abstraction inversion
Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 22:17:47 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Darin Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>But the key distinction, again, of microkernels is the philosophy of
>their design - small and simple executive, with services layered on
>top. Just as with high level applications built of multiple processes
>or threads, you possibly gain functionality and flexibility at the
>possible expense of memory or cpu efficiency.
There can also be benefits in reliability and security. In a macrokernel,
the potential interactions between kernel modules are almost unlimited,
making it very difficult to verify these attributes. A microkernel
typically provides a limited messaging interface between the higher layer
modules, and each module can be debugged independently.
It does add complexity -- you have to design explicit communication
mechanisms between all these modules, rather than allowing them to access
the monolithic, shared kernel memory. As with OO programming, you have to
do more careful design of interfaces, rather than accessing everything ad
hoc. Theoretically, this should result in an improved design.
--
Barry Margolin, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
GTE Internetworking, Powered by BBN, Burlington, MA
*** DON'T SEND TECHNICAL QUESTIONS DIRECTLY TO ME, post them to newsgroups.
Please DON'T copy followups to me -- I'll assume it wasn't posted to the group.
------------------------------
From: James Lewis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: RealPlayer 5.0 on Kernel 2.2.2
Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 19:17:55 -0500
Bob Schreibmaier wrote:
> I just upgraded to kernel 2.2.2, using XFree86 3.3.3.1, and
> noticed that RealPlayer 5.0 has stopped working. It starts
> up with the usual window, but gives the dreaded "Error 1" as
> soon as it starts playing the movie
There is a fix for the problem. Seach altavista with "realplayer" and
"linux" ... There is a small object/program you load before rvplayer
runs to fix the problem. I wish I still had the URL for it, but I
installed it a long time ago.
-James
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (brian moore)
Crossposted-To:
comp.unix.questions,comp.unix.advocacy,comp.unix.misc,comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc
Subject: Re: Best Free Unix? (why FreeBSD?)
Date: 27 Feb 1999 00:23:50 GMT
On 27 Feb 99 00:03:16 GMT,
Zenin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> [posted & mailed]
Don't do that, it's annoying.
> brian moore <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> : On 26 Feb 1999 13:58:39 -0600,
> : Leslie Mikesell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> :
> : Okay, mod_perl (which does have tons of GPL'd code)
>
> Please show me a single line of GPL code in mod_perl, I must have
> missed it. But then, I'm only human so maybe I should let a
> computer look for me:
>
> $ cd mod_perl-1.18
> $ grep -il GPL `find . -type f`
> $
>
> Hmm, maybe it would work better if I used GNU grep and find?
Or if you learned to use your tools properly.
Missed the -Lperl, eh?
> : works great with Apache (BSD-ish license) and RSAREF (mutant license).
>
> Yes, it does, because does not carry the GPL.
PHP3 certainly does. Mod_perl does by implication of linking to libperl.
> While the AL is far more restrictive then BSD, it's still light
> years away from the GPL and unlike the GPL it doesn't go out of its
> way to explicitly lie to its users.
I still don't see a lie in the GPL.
It protects the rights of the original author at the cost of subsequent
authors who are told up front the terms.
BSD, on the other hand, gives rights to subsequent authors and denies
the same rights to the original author, and allows them to change the
terms of the deal at any point in the game, including withholding
changes from the author.
> : Actually, that's the argument you have been presenting: you argue that the
> : BSD license is better because it allows you to take code from others and
> : not share your changes.
>
> What right should *you* have over the life of *my* code?
Whatever rights you choose to agree to. What rights do you have over
the life of mine? The BSD license (and those here arguing how it is
"superior") say that you have even the right to take without giving
anything back.
I don't like that, and generally don't use BSD licenses on my work.
(If I don't care about it, I release it as public domain.)
--
Brian Moore | "The Zen nature of a spammer resembles
Sysadmin, C/Perl Hacker | a cockroach, except that the cockroach
Usenet Vandal | is higher up on the evolutionary chain."
Netscum, Bane of Elves. Peter Olson, Delphi Postmaster
------------------------------
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.unix.advocacy,comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Louis Epstein)
Subject: Re: Best Free Unix? (why FreeBSD?)
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 00:17:50 GMT
Edward Avis ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: Paul Hughett wrote:
:
: >>>They would
: >>>have to add VERY SIGNIFICANT IP to make $$$ (or ###, or whatever).
: >
: >>What country uses # as a currency? :-(
: >
: >In the US we call # a pound sign. Is that enough hint?
:
: I know, I know. It was a rhetorical question.
:
: The symbol # is called a pound sign in the US, but this refers to
: pounds in weight (lb), not pounds the currency.
Of course,a thousand years ago,the pound sterling(currency) originated
as a troy pound of sterling silver...though the currency unit will now
buy only a fraction of a troy OUNCE of sterling silver.
------------------------------
From: "Nick Warrington" <nick@(NOSPAM_TA_VERY_MUCH)majikman.demon.co.uk>
Subject: enlightenment
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 00:05:56 -0000
I am trying to compile the glib library on a newley installed Linux System.
It will not compile because make complains about a missing header file
dlfnc.h. The error goes something like '
in file included from gmodule.c. gmodule-dl.c
dlfcn.h :no such file or directory.
The file doesnt seem to exist on my system at all. Does anyone know why I
may be having problems or what library I need to install to get glib to
install.
Sorry if this is a bit of a lame question, but I am a newbie (as if you
didnt notice) and I need help cos progress has ground to a halt.
If anyone has tried to install this library and has ANY ideas then
pleeeeease mail me or reply to this posting.
All in the attempt to get enlightenment to install :)
Thanks in advance
Nick
------------------------------
From: Yan Seiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Apache WEB server.
Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 17:41:51 -0500
Premature end of script headers can be due to either binary uploads or sytax
errors.
Yan
Bob McLaren wrote:
> Are you FTPing your perl scripts to your webserver?
> I FINALLY solved this problem on my server by verifying an ASCII FTP
> transfer to my web server as opposed to a BINARY transfer.
> I believe the CHR(10) and CHR(13) carriage return characters weren't being
> translated correctly because I was using binary transfer.
> Hope this helps.
>
> "Jesper K. Pedersen" wrote:
>
> > Evening everyone.
> >
> > After struggling alot with Apache I feel close to giving up.
> >
> > The webserver runs fine - I can access it locally as well as from a
> > remote location.
> > When I get to the fun part with cgi-scripts it gets a bit worse.
> >
> > Basically nomatter what Perl script (ready made from the net) that I try
> > out - it terminates with an error message :
> >
> > something something something "reason: premature end of script headers"
> > [somedate].
> >
> > Can anyone give me a clue of why ?
> > Im hinted at by the helpfiles that its the way that Perl handles its
> > "prints" to the server - and that i manually have to rework the scripts.
> > And ive tried that - but with the same result.
> >
> > Best regards
> > Jesper K. Pedersen
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> --
> Bob McLaren
> Network Administration
> Financial Statement Services, Inc.
> HTTP://WWW.FSSI-CA.COM
------------------------------
From: Gerald Willmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: process ID question
Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 16:36:09 -0800
I'm trying to switch on and off the scanner on my SCSI bus. The following
scripts work fine as root
#!/bin/sh
echo "scsi add-single-device 0 0 6 0" > /proc/scsi/scsi
#!/bin/sh
echo "scsi remove-single-device 0 0 6 0" > /proc/scsi/scsi
but not for mortal users. I tried setting SUID on both but that didn't
change anything - still getting permission denied on /proc. Is there a way
to let normal users do this. Thanks,
Gerald
_________________________________________________
Gerald Willmann Department of Economics
96F Escondido Vlg. Stanford University
Stanford, CA 94305 CA 94305-6072, USA
+1(650)497-0902 725-8921 / 5702 (fax)
------------------------------
From: Michael Proto <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Sound Blaster AWE 64 Gold
Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 19:54:12 -0500
DaStOp wrote:
>
> I read the Sound HOWTO & I noticed that the Kernel does not support the S.B.
> AWE 64 Gold Soundcard. I would like to know if there is a newer Kernel that
> supports it or if anyone knows some way to make it work. Thanx! :)
>
> -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
> http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
You might want to look at the OSS driver by http://www.opensound.com.
Its $20, but it has great support for most all sound cards available. I
use it with my AWE64 just fine, and it even has an optional synth module
that allows the use of wavetable sound (which the Linux kernel doesn't
support, atleast on 2.0.36.
--
-] Michael Proto [-
-] MCP: Win95 [-
-] Happy Linux user since 1997 [-
ERROR: REALITY.SYS Corrupted! Reboot universe? (Y/n)
------------------------------
From: "gc" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.admin,comp.os.linux.hardware,comp.os.linux.questions
Subject: Re: digi board PC/Xe config is actually very simple!
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 01:17:59 GMT
NEVERMIND...
I stopped whining for thirty seconds, made the devices, and it all works.
SO: DIGI PC/Xe is actually so simple...I was looking for a more difficult
solution.
If you compile version 2.0.36, or wherever digi support began, and compile
it in...
and then do a
mknod cud0 c 22 0
mknod cud1 c 22 1
etc for as many ports
and
mknod ttyD0 c 23 0
mknod ttyD1 c 23 1
etc, that's all there is to it.
The digi web/ftp site, commendable as it is for them to provide Linux
info...is WAY out of date.
but thanks for putting up with my whining!
- George C
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
gc wrote in message ...
>I have a digi pc/xe board with 8 ports. Had it working, backed up the
>configs, which took a LONG time to arrive at a few years ago, and the
floppy
>I backed onto was bad, and I nuked the whole installation on that box...I
>have nothing to show for a whole lot of research in 1996.
>
>So...can anybody walk me thru a real world install? I have the file
>4001450C.tgz, and it is unratted from /usr/include as some faq somewhere
>indicated to do(on the digi ftp site). It just plain doesn't work.
>digiConfig calls a menu program "dialog" which won't run, keeps exiting
>saying cant't open terminal, etc, etc...just does not work. I've tried
>/usr/src, and more...no good.
>
>Now...I am running version 2.0.36 with digi enabled, and in devices ttyD
and
>cud are there after bootup. Do I only need to make devices for it? A small
>hassle, but easy, considering I've been beating my head against the wall
for
>several evenings(It's ok, I wear a rug).
>
>Looks like major number is 23 and 22 respectively from /proc/devices.
>
>I just need some input before I spin my wheels tonight again. The bottle of
>Bacardi is looking pretty good right about now.
>
>-George C
>
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Juergen Heinzl)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.os.linux.hardware
Subject: Re: Pentium III Boycott and survey info
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 00:42:35 GMT
In article <7b6uci$1t1$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, John Meissen wrote:
>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>Boycott Swintel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Pentium III chip with the individual serial number that can
>>track your web surfing and buying habits can now have the ID number
>>turned on and off by software.
>
>This is untrue. The fact is, the feature can be disabled with software,
>but it can ONLY be turned back on by a full hardware reset.
No, it can be turned on by software, but ...
[...]
>A boycot based on this is ridiculous. Whether you use the chip
>or not should depend on the capabilities of the CPU and if you
>feel they meet your needs.
[...]
... nothing more to say. BTW, anyone with an American Express or VISA
card ... think about it ;-)
Cheers,
Juergen
--
\ Real name : J�rgen Heinzl \ no flames /
\ EMail Private : [EMAIL PROTECTED] \ send money instead /
\ Phone Private : +44 181-332 0750 \ /
------------------------------
From: "Brian Donovan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Anti-Virus for Linux
Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 20:18:40 -0500
Hi, I was wondering if there is any anti-viral utilities available for
linux. I'm at college with ethernet and like the biological type computer
viruses tend to pass rather quick. Thanks for your help,
Brian Donovan
------------------------------
From: DanH <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux
Subject: Re: ...a Linux RedHat Technician/Superuser ?
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 00:14:58 +0000
Jonah99 wrote:
>
> Hey, you look very familiar to me too >>>> ))) handshake
>
> Thanks for the advice, Dan. I'm gonna hunt for those Books and
> then I'm gonna read for a month nonstop (Jonah going on leave from 1st
> March)...
> Yuppeeee !
>
> By the way, how does Solaris compare with Linux ? Have heard some
> promissing things about Solaris. Figure that should be the next O/S to
> tackle after REDHAT.
I'm used to some of the conventions in Linux that Solaris didn't have so
I have a big alias series in my .cshrc but other than that it's just a
matter of figuring out where everything is and what they call that
particular thing. Matter of fact, I'm trying to figure out what Linux
calls the '.rhosts' that work in a Solaris box to not have to log into
trusted hosts when 'rsh' to them.
Hmmm
Dan
------------------------------
From: Frank Hale <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux g++
Date: 27 Feb 1999 01:24:04 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> I recently installed Linux and when I compile code with g++, it creates an
> exe in my current directory just like it should, but when I type in the name
> of that exe to run it, it says that it cannot find *x* command. Is this
> because I need to change my PATH variable in my login file? Is it looking in
> the wrong place? Thanks for any and all help.
>
try doing this
./your_exe_here
That should clear it up.
--
From: Frank Hale
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
ICQ: 7205161
Website: www.franksstuff.com - new host but my domain hasn't
transferred yet.
"Knowledge only takes you so far, Determination takes you the rest of
the way"
------------------------------
From: "gc" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.admin,comp.os.linux.hardware,comp.os.linux.questions
Subject: digi board
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 00:49:57 GMT
I have a digi pc/xe board with 8 ports. Had it working, backed up the
configs, which took a LONG time to arrive at a few years ago, and the floppy
I backed onto was bad, and I nuked the whole installation on that box...I
have nothing to show for a whole lot of research in 1996.
So...can anybody walk me thru a real world install? I have the file
4001450C.tgz, and it is unratted from /usr/include as some faq somewhere
indicated to do(on the digi ftp site). It just plain doesn't work.
digiConfig calls a menu program "dialog" which won't run, keeps exiting
saying cant't open terminal, etc, etc...just does not work. I've tried
/usr/src, and more...no good.
Now...I am running version 2.0.36 with digi enabled, and in devices ttyD and
cud are there after bootup. Do I only need to make devices for it? A small
hassle, but easy, considering I've been beating my head against the wall for
several evenings(It's ok, I wear a rug).
Looks like major number is 23 and 22 respectively from /proc/devices.
I just need some input before I spin my wheels tonight again. The bottle of
Bacardi is looking pretty good right about now.
-George C
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: "Rich Mycroft" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Samba and Redhat 5.2
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 05:58:50 -0500
Yes, my linux machine smbmount's to my nt box every time it boots. Had to
turn off password encryption to get it though. And this is under RH 5.2.
Don't know the answer to your problem though. Might try NFS. There is a
free download from MS (user beware!) to get NFS for NT.
rich mycroft
Theo van der Merwe wrote in message <7b2p8v$11bn$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
>I would like to know whether anyone have been able to use Samba (smbmount)
>successfully with Redhat 5.2? The command smbclient works (I can see the
>shares and transfer files), but smbmount gives the error message 'device or
>resource busy' (on two separate Redhat installations). What alternatives
can
>I use to mount the Windows shares (including the printer) into Linux?
>
>Thanks in advance for your help,
>Theo van der Merwe ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
>
>
>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David M. Cook)
Subject: Re: linux commmands
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 11:56:58 GMT
On Mon, 22 Feb 1999 00:41:00 +0000, Natanael Copa <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>how do i turn my computor off? Now I use "reboot" or just ctrl-alt-del
>and wait until linux is shut down and turn it off before lilo restarts.
>I'm shure there is a better way...
You can make ctrl-alt-del do a shutdown instead of a halt by editing
/etc/inittab:
# Trap CTRL-ALT-DELETE
ca::ctrlaltdel:/sbin/shutdown -t3 -h now
I find that pretty convenient. If you have a newer machine that will poweroff
on shutdown, you can recompile your kernel to support this.
However, if it's a desktop machine I'd just leave it on continuously.
Dave Cook
------------------------------
From: "D. Vrabel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux.questions,comp.os.linux.help,comp.os.linux.questions,comp.os.linux.setup,linux.redhat.misc
Subject: Re: disk otpimization & defragmentat?
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 13:41:50 +0000
On Thu, 25 Feb 1999, Stefano Piccarolo wrote:
> Is there any utility to optimize disk access speed by defragmenting the
> files?
It is unlikly that your ext2 filesystems will become suffieciently
fragemented for this to become a problem. My partition has never been more
than 1%. However, is you are desperate there is a ext2 defragmentation
tool out there.
Defragmentation is only a problem with archaic filesystems such as FAT32
and friends.
David
--
David Vrabel
Engineering Undergraduate at University of Cambridge, UK.
------------------------------
From: David Kirkpatrick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Can Linux run on NT for stability?
Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 20:27:17 +0000
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I'm not exactly sure but I think your refering to the NT server
as a physical box and wanting to run Linux on it not with it.
The answer is yes by installing it on your system. Within a
month after you get over the initial frustration you'll be
wanting give NT the boot.
Since in my opinion it takes a little time to get use to Linux
and building a dual boot disk has a few I got'ya type of things
in the process you might want to pick up a cheap 1 gig disk and
do a custom install on it and load it up with the networking
things you'll need for a server. That way you can boot into
either system and if you run into problems at first with Linux
which is likely you can revert to the NT server. Over time when
you get used to the admining of Linux you'll find it quite nice
and probably more reliable than NT.
What would be interesting is to take one of your lesser machine -
suit it up with Linux and run some some NT/Linux comparisons with
it and see what happens.
For starting out it might be easier to start with RH 5.2 until
you get used to Linux then possibly select some other flavor
depeining your needs. But RH will probably catch up quickly and
encorporate the usefull features of other releases very quickly.
If you decide to dual boot then download the HOWTO's from a
mirror and go through those. Search deja news to look at the
problems other people have run into with setting up a dual boot.
With NT and 95 dual boot setup was easy but I had a few problems
with 98 as the 98 install was very fussy. But again I would
recommend a seperate disk for a margin of safety as it looks like
your doing this on a production server.
d
moi wrote:
>
> I have found my NT server very reliable, and want to run Linux on it. Is this
> possible? I know some people say Linux is stable, but I don't want to take a
> chance.
>
> moi
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dennis Smith)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.lang.smalltalk
Subject: Re: Should IBM port Visual Age for Java to Linux?
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 13:47:20 GMT
On Thu, 25 Feb 1999 07:41:30 -0500, "Bob Jarvis"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Peter Hatch wrote in message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
>>The purpose of stating the press release
>>the way it was stated was to gauge public opinion about the option of
>>re-introducing runtimes for certain customers (also to see if the 90%
>>price reduction could justify runtimes or a deployment license). We
>>shall see...
>
>
>I don't know what other feedback you're getting, but I'm not interested in
>paying for a runtime license. I'd rather use Smalltalk, but if it's a
>choice between Smalltalk and runtime fees or something else without runtime
>fees I'll probably choose "something else". C++ on Linux is cheap.
If you want ST, you have to pay for it. You can
- pay for it up front (higher cost)
- pay for it a bit up front and more later
- maybe pay for it a bit up front and more later
as a "deployment one-time charge"
There is a serious problem created by the "I won't pay runtime fee"
argument, and that is that it hurts small companies who are trying
to get rolling in the 2 or 3 years up-to deployment time.
If you think removing runtime fees makes things cheaper (as
some here seem to), you are being pretty naive. If it costs
$x per year to build and maintain a product, and if there will
be 'n' development licenses, the cost will be x/n no matter what,
and the average cost per devloper will be the same, with or
without runtime fees. The only arguments I see against
runtime fees are those of administration -- its a nuisance,
so that is why I suggest a couple of fee structures.
=================================================================
Dennis Smith, MaSc -- Cherniak Software Development Corporation
400-10 Commerce Valley Dr E, Thornhill ON Canada L3T 7N7
Phone: 905.771.7011 FAX: 905.771.6288
[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.cherniak.on.ca
------------------------------
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End of Linux-Misc Digest
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