Linux-Misc Digest #884, Volume #19 Sun, 18 Apr 99 08:13:15 EDT
Contents:
Re: linux being user-friendly (root)
Re: [LILO] Trying to boot, just get "L 01 01 01..." - Fixed (mostly) (Pedro R.
Andrade)
Re: linux being user-friendly (root)
LILO with IDE & SCSI ("Kissandrakis S. Gewrgios")
Re: Disturbing information - Linux vs NT - true or false? - Educated (Jerry Lynn
Kreps)
Re: Linux MIDI (brian moore)
LILO & SCSI (Kissandrakis George)
Re: Linux lock-ups (Killingtime "@drum14.freeserve.co.uk>)
Re: imap (John Thompson)
Re: Newbie Questions: reading floppies (Jerry Brown)
Re: d/l recoverey (brian moore)
Re: imap (brian moore)
Re: cross-device links (brian moore)
Re: How to find IP addr of remote connection? (Ron Bergeron)
Re: What-ya-ma-callit ("Cameron Spitzer")
Netscape/Playmidi on Kernel 2.2.x (Bob Schreibmaier)
Re: Boot problem (kernel 2.2.6) ("mox")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: root <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: linux being user-friendly
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 21:42:28 -0500
Nathan Ranger wrote:
> Hellraiser,
>
> To try and get Linux to be more user friendly, IMHO, will wreck its
> stability. It will be just another Win/MacOS/NoviceTinkertoy(NT) OS in
> the end and we'll all be looking for something that Linux "used" to be.
This is false. Ease of understanding/use has nothing to do with stability.
Stability comes from proper design and testing.
> If the users want something stable and easy, let them run NT
> workstation. The ideal network in my mind for the average stable and
> usable network:
>
> NT Workstations for the Lusers...
>
> -NR
>
> hellraiser wrote:
> >
> > why are poeple trying to make linux user-friendly? i don't think linux
> > should be any user-friendly than it already is. the morons complaining
> > about linux having to many confusing aspects or cryptic commands, etc.
> > etc. shouldn't be using linux and should use windows instead. not
> > everyone should use linux...
> >
> > what do you think??
Well, you asked.
I think you two are acting like a couple of snobs. If anyone asked me
what the ideal os was, I'd have to say it was one where any neophyte
could come in and get up to speed with the applications and become
productive in minimum time (GUI?). It would also be one which
would allow a skilled person to get down into its guts and configure,
fix, or manipulate the system at will (only limited by the ability of
the user). This operating system would also protect itself heartily
from accidental disruption by the unsuspecting neophyte and even
intentional disruption from poor-intentioned neer-do-wells. Did
someone say Unix? Now, *I* want to be able to afford this operating
system. Did someone say *Linux*?
To perpetuate this attitude of 'you morons aren't smart enough to use
Linux', is to stifle the develolpment of Linux. Already, we see that
virtualy *no* peripheral companies, ISPs, etc. have a clue when the
user calls and says Linux. The only place to get info on 'How do I get
my Voodoo XYZ to work with X', is here. You call up Voodoo and
they just shrug or email you 10Meg worth of Win95 drivers. :^(
Virtually nobody ports their great applications (and there are some) to
Linux as the user base is too low and the profit vs. cost is unacceptable.
This is going to change rapidly with the commercialism of Linux. It is
going to cause some problems at first but I believe the core of Linux is
so stable and so strong, that it can withstand this. As long as Torvalds
et al control the kernel, the worst thing that can happen is you need to
keep your process killing skills up to date. :^)
What most of these neophytes need is not more intelligence, not more
RTFM responses, but rather a hint as to where to go in their manual to
find what they are looking for. The average users on a stand alone box
clearly don't need most of the manual. They can do everything they
need simply by reading 'Linux for Dummies'. Unfortunately, they
can't seem to even get their system up because the os is still in it's
university clothes and it requires a deeper knowlege to get the system
up and running. RedHat et al are changing this and this is good. Is
there any of you administrators who can't do your job through RedHat's
facade? If so, let them know where they are breaking the system.
The manuals I have are mostly aimed at the average system adminis-
trator rather than the average user. In time, this will improve. This
will not hurt Linux in the least. It will only help those who wish to
take advantage of a more stable operating system. More people using
Linux means more commercial software for Linux and even more
importantly, more peripherals companies recognizing the need to
support Linux users. You don't have to buy the commercial software,
but at least you will have the option. The people who wish to become
power users will always have that option.
Just my opinion.
Rick
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pedro R. Andrade)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: [LILO] Trying to boot, just get "L 01 01 01..." - Fixed (mostly)
Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 06:20:45 GMT
The "L 01 01 01 ..." problem happened to me when I changed
my IDE Secondary master on my drive.
It disappeared when I was able to boot again (in my case to Dos
with a boot disk but it seems that's not your case),
run "FDISK /MBR", then to linux, and it was fixed after reinstalling
Lilo.
Hope this may be of some help to you, but I really don't know anything
about SCSI.
Pedro Andrade
On 15 Apr 1999 22:46:07 GMT, alex@ifurita. (Alex Taylor) wrote:
>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, brian moore wrote:
>>On 14 Apr 1999 02:05:47 GMT,
>> Alex Taylor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>
>>> (1) I didn't like the messages about /dev/hda in the lilo output, since
>>> that's my floppy drive, which shouldn't even enter into the picture! So
>>> I made certain I had no disks in the drive (I thought I'd tried that
>>> already, but I could be wrong).
>>
>>Actually, /dev/hda is the primary drive on the first IDE controller.
>>Your floppy is /dev/fd0.
>
>Not so, my floppy is an LS-120 drive on the first IDE controller, and is
>my only IDE device. Hence, /dev/hda.
>
>I have no devices on /dev/fd* - in fact, I've disabled my MB's floppy
>controller in the BIOS, since I have no need of it.
>
>--------------------------
>Alex Taylor
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: root <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: linux being user-friendly
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 21:50:44 -0500
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Linux HAS to change its command-line interface for a graphic interface. Now,
> only the experts can use Linux, but it is made for everyone. We can make it
> attractive to the users by changing its interface.
>
> JORRAMI
I heartily disagree. Linux has GUI and command line for a reason. This is the
best of both worlds. It does *not* take an expert to use Linux. It only takes
an expert to set it up. After that, it is a very easy operating system to use.
RedHat et al are changing the setup problem. Pretty soon, it will be as easy
as Windoze to set up. After that, you will see a lot less bitching and a whole
lot more enthusiastic "Hey, how do I do this? I saw it on Joe's computer and
it's great. I want to learn how to do it. What manual did you say that was in?"
Rick
------------------------------
From: "Kissandrakis S. Gewrgios" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.hardware
Subject: LILO with IDE & SCSI
Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 13:25:39 -0200
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Hi
I have an IDE with linux and a SCSI with NT4
In the bios there is a selection for booting from IDE bus or SCSI bus
if i install lilo on IDE MRB (and IDE bus seletion in bios) and choose
lilo in hangs on "loading winnt" (linux boots normally)
if i install lilo on SCSI MRB (and SCSI bus selection in bios) lilo
hangs on LI
any suggestions?
thnx in advance
Kissandrakis Georg
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: Jerry Lynn Kreps <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Disturbing information - Linux vs NT - true or false? - Educated
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 20:38:01 -0500
Mark Hahn wrote:
>
> > da> If Mindcraft would say the opposite, that Linux was faster then NT, I
> > da> wonder how many of you would say that Mindcraft did not know what they
> > da> were doing. So Apache sucks, so what. Just means that Apache
>
> if Mindcraft actually did not deliberately rig the competition,
> there will be thousands of astonished Linux hackers. it's hard
> to find _anything_ they did right, and the litany of specific,
> seemingly deliberate "detuning" examples is long.
Yup. It was the best benchmark Gates could buy. Just like that poll
and the video tape, all phony.
--
JLK
Linux, because it's STABLE, the source code is included, the price is
right.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (brian moore)
Subject: Re: Linux MIDI
Date: 18 Apr 1999 03:32:38 GMT
On 17 Apr 1999 23:07:30 -0400,
steven finney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> What I need at this point is simply a raw (byte-stream) interface
> to a MIDI device. The box I had came with a es1371 (Soundblaster
> PCI64 installed). Now, although there was an es1371.o, there appeared
> to be no driver source, which was perturbing.
You didn't look very hard, then. /usr/src/linux/drivers/sound/es1371.c
Also check /usr/src/linux/Documentation/sound/es1371.
--
Brian Moore | "The Zen nature of a spammer resembles
Sysadmin, C/Perl Hacker | a cockroach, except that the cockroach
Usenet Vandal | is higher up on the evolutionary chain."
Netscum, Bane of Elves. Peter Olson, Delphi Postmaster
------------------------------
From: Kissandrakis George <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: LILO & SCSI
Date: 18 Apr 1999 10:32:15 GMT
I have installed REDHAT 5.2 on an IDE DISK
there is a scsi disk with WinNT 4 workstation on the same PC
there is a choise in bios where the PC boot from (IDE bus or SCSI bus)
if i install lilo on the IDE (linux disk,IDE bus selection) and try to boot
in NT hangs on
"Loadint winnt"
if i install lilo on the SCSI (winnt disk,SCSI bus selection) hangs on LI
any suggestions?
thnx in advance
Kissandrakis George
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
================== Posted via SearchLinux ==================
http://www.searchlinux.com
------------------------------
From: Killingtime <"matt<NO SPAM>"@drum14.freeserve.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Linux lock-ups
Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 08:51:01 +0100
Not a reply, but confirmation that some companies are selling 100MHz Ram which
turns out to be 66MHz Myself the recipient of such..
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> I previously used RedHat 5.2 on a p200 with 64meg of ram with no problems.In
> December I upgraded to an Asus P2B with 128 Meg ram and an experiening severe
> lock-ups in X. Is there a torture-test program that runs under Linux that will
> point me in the right direction? I tend to suspect the ram since a lot of ram
> sold as 100mhz doesn't cut it.
>
> Any help would be appriciated.
>
> Thanks, Mike Shimanski
>
> -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
> http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
------------------------------
From: John Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: imap
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 21:42:15 -0600
NewsReader wrote:
> I was wondering if there are any email clients for linux that uses IMAP to
> retrive mail?
pine, Netscape and StarOffice come to mind. There may be
others.
--
-John ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jerry Brown)
Subject: Re: Newbie Questions: reading floppies
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 03:37:22 GMT
It is probably already mounted; read the file /ect/fstab to see what
is already mounted when sys starts.
On my sys, the drive is mounted as /mnt/floppy; if you want to use a
MS-Dos Disk, unmount the drive listed in fstab and remount as a msdos
drive.
On 15 Apr 1999 17:51:44 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (TsProdehl) wrote:
>I have linux installed on a separate harddrive on my home computer. I normally
>worked in Windows98, using GVIM to doTeX coding..
>
>I installed Linux to be able to use TeX, composing files, checking errors, etc.
>All my files on disk are basically ascii files. I've read several docs on how
>to mount a floppy. For the life of me I cannot get to the floppy files on disk.
>I get an error saying floppy already mounted, too many...But I still cannot
>even view the files on the floppy. This system is not even reading the floppy.
>Can someone give me a consistant "no-fail" way to mount and view floppies so
>that I can use these files on Linux and use their TeX program?
>
>Thanks for any help!
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (brian moore)
Subject: Re: d/l recoverey
Date: 18 Apr 1999 03:38:45 GMT
On Sat, 17 Apr 1999 16:52:44 +0200,
Tony Ekron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi all
> Anyone done anything yet with d'l recovery
> I am looking for a prog like getright but for linux
> anyone know of anything like that
Other than wget, snarf, GREED and a whole slew of others?
--
Brian Moore | "The Zen nature of a spammer resembles
Sysadmin, C/Perl Hacker | a cockroach, except that the cockroach
Usenet Vandal | is higher up on the evolutionary chain."
Netscum, Bane of Elves. Peter Olson, Delphi Postmaster
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (brian moore)
Subject: Re: imap
Date: 18 Apr 1999 03:39:42 GMT
On Sat, 17 Apr 1999 00:02:27 -0700,
NewsReader <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I was wondering if there are any email clients for linux that uses IMAP to
> retrive mail?
xfmail, PINE, Mutt, and fetchmail all handle IMAP.
--
Brian Moore | "The Zen nature of a spammer resembles
Sysadmin, C/Perl Hacker | a cockroach, except that the cockroach
Usenet Vandal | is higher up on the evolutionary chain."
Netscum, Bane of Elves. Peter Olson, Delphi Postmaster
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (brian moore)
Subject: Re: cross-device links
Date: 18 Apr 1999 01:48:18 GMT
On Sun, 18 Apr 1999 01:35:08 GMT,
Mark Robinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Is there any way I can use cross-device links?
With symlinks, yes. Not hard links.
--
Brian Moore | "The Zen nature of a spammer resembles
Sysadmin, C/Perl Hacker | a cockroach, except that the cockroach
Usenet Vandal | is higher up on the evolutionary chain."
Netscum, Bane of Elves. Peter Olson, Delphi Postmaster
------------------------------
From: Ron Bergeron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: How to find IP addr of remote connection?
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 1999 21:50:54 -0400
Are you trying to find the IP address of the Linux machine that you
are telnetting to or the machine that you are telnetting from?
If you are trying to find the address of the machine that you are
telnetting FROM, you could try using netstat. Something like this
should do it:
netstat -na | grep :23 | grep EST | awk '{print $5}' | cut -d: -f1
The problem with that is that it will show you the IP addresses of
ALL machines that are currently logged in via telnet.
Warren Odom wrote:
>
> After I telnet into my Red Hat 5.1 system over the Internet, I need to find
> out the (varying) IP address that my ISP has assigned me (the IP address
> that the Linux box knows me by). The only way I know to do this is to look
> at the last line of /var/log/secure. But that requires me to become the
> super-user. I'd like to automate the process of getting that IP address, so
> is there any other way to get this information without having to deal with
> su?
>
> Thanks -- Warren
------------------------------
From: "Cameron Spitzer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: What-ya-ma-callit
Date: 18 Apr 1999 03:51:13 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Nathan Ranger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Tony,
>
>Linux makes a great gateway machine. I am typing on a win95 machine and
>have other other here in the house. I also have 3 linux machines. 1 is a
>gateway/DNS box. One is an ip monitoring (sniffer) box / secondary DNS
>and the other is an application machine (which happens to be very sick
>at the moment). They all use one modem to connect to the internet. They
>are all on a 10b2 LAN with NE2000 compatible ethernet cards.
>
>gateway's address is 10.0.2.2
>scanner's address is 10.0.2.3
>devon's address is 10.0.2.4
>fireball's address is 10.0.2.5
>beast's address is 10.0.2.6
>Now, I can't use hyperterminal on the windoze boxes or anything like
>that,
Sure you can. Telnet from the windoze box to gateway, with
windoze telnet client of your choice. Log into shell on gateway.
Run tip(1) or cu(1) or minicom(1) on gateway.
The cu(1) program comes with Taylor UUCP.
The others are filed under "communications" or "serial" in the archives.
Or get one of the freeware X servers (SuSE distributes one and there
are two others on Tucows) for Win-95 and run Seyon on gateway
with its display remoted to the X-on-Win95 window.
You get a fancier dialout but it won't cut-and-paste with Windoz.
If the question is "can Linux do that" the answer is usually yes.
Cameron
------------------------------
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.setup
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Schreibmaier)
Subject: Netscape/Playmidi on Kernel 2.2.x
Date: Sun, 18 Apr 1999 12:05:01 GMT
I just upgraded from kernel 2.0.36 to 2.2.6 and noticed a problem
with playing MIDI files on Netscape 4.51. I have been using playmidi
to play MIDI files, with mimeplugin to set up all the plug-ins.
If you click on a site with embedded MIDI files, both play the music
just fine. However, with 2.2.6, if you then go off to another web
site, the music doesn't stop! With 2.0.36, if you went to another
site, the music stopped immediately.
Any ideas how to get around this rather annoying problem? I would
like to use the 2.2.x kernels, as Netscape definitely starts up MUCH
faster than with 2.0.36.
TIA.
Bob
--
+--------------------------------------------------------+
| Bob Schreibmaier K3PH | E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] |
| Kresgeville, PA 18333 | ICBM: 40o55'N 75o30'W |
+--------------------------------------------------------+
------------------------------
From: "mox" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Boot problem (kernel 2.2.6)
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 08:06:14 -0400
I updated everyting
and on www.kernel.org, there is not a lot of infos..
Killingtime @drum14.freeserve.co.uk> <"matt<NO SPAM> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Check the site where you got the kernel from. You may find that there are
other
> dependencies that need updating, such as gcc, and the bin utils.
>
> mox wrote:
>
> > I don't use lilo, my HD don't support it.. maybe because it is too big
> > (20gig)
> > I boot from a floppy made by (cat zImage > /dev/fd0)
> > My old kernel version (2.0.36) works fine like that.. I think the
problem is
> > more with configuration
> >
> > Killingtime @drum14.freeserve.co.uk> <"matt<NO SPAM> wrote in message
> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > If you recompiled the Kernel and then moved it to /vmlinuz did you
type
> > 'lilo'.
> > > This may solve your problem. You will need to use your boot floppy to
get
> > > access to your partition.
> > > mount root=/dev/hxx
> > >
> > > mox wrote:
> > >
> > > > Anyone have an idea why my system halt right after the boot disk
says:
> > "Ok,
> > > > now booting the kernel..."
> > > >
> > > > I just installed the kernel v2.2.6..
> > > > I don't know why.. many ppl said to me to remove some things into my
> > config,
> > > > I made what the asked me to remove, but I have no results... the
problem
> > > > can't be my system.. (p2 333 / 20gig / 96 ram)
> > > > I think the problem is my kernel configuration, cause the v2.0.36
boot
> > fine.
> > >
>
------------------------------
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End of Linux-Misc Digest
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