Linux-Misc Digest #35, Volume #20 Mon, 3 May 99 06:13:12 EDT
Contents:
Re: The GNU Fragrance of Sharing vs. the Stench of Greed (was: GNU reeks of
Communism (really) (Donovan Rebbechi)
HELP YAMAHA YMF715E-S ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Mac-emulation on Linux? ("FM")
Re: Windows NT vs. Linux testing by mindcraft (Jesus Monroy, Jr.)
Re: How to upgrade Debian? (Michael & Kyrstin Westwind)
Re: SUID games? What is RedHat doing? (Bill Unruh)
Re: SUID games? What is RedHat doing? (Chris Lee)
Re: Memory being limited to 16M (Garen Parham)
Re: md5sum - improvement? (J.H.M. Dassen (Ray))
Re: XANIM and .avi files (jason)
Re: md5sum - improvement? ("D. Vrabel")
Re: StarOffice 5.0 (Jeremy Weinberger)
fetchmail (Anup Rao)
Re: GNU reeks of Communism (Michael Powe)
Re: Gnome Help ! (Matthias Warkus)
Re: Alpha Server + WinNT + DOS progs??? (Matthias Warkus)
Re: The Best Linux distribution? (was Re: FreeBSD vs. Linux) ("S�ren Klintrup")
Re: SUID games? What is RedHat doing? (Rob Komar)
Where can I find libncurses.so.3.0 ? (ms)
Re: The GNU Fragrance of Sharing vs. the Stench of Greed (was: GNU reeks of
Communism (really) (Floyd Davidson)
Re: The GNU Fragrance of Sharing vs. the Stench of Greed (was: GNU reeks of
Communism (really) (LEBLANC ERIC)
Re: Xfree Matrox Mil (Zdravko Balorda)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Crossposted-To:
talk.politics.misc,comp.os.linux.advocacy,alt.activism,alt.society.liberalism
Subject: Re: The GNU Fragrance of Sharing vs. the Stench of Greed (was: GNU reeks of
Communism (really)
Date: 3 May 1999 05:31:00 GMT
On Mon, 03 May 1999 05:00:39 +0000, Colin R. Day wrote:
>Chris Costello wrote:
>It only forces openness if you use GPLed code. Or is someone
>holding a gun to your head to use such code? One might as well
>say that Microsoft forces one to obey the EULA.
I think Mr Costello's point (given that he's a FreeBSD advocate)
is that both the MS EULA and the GPL are considerably more restrictive
than the FreeBSD-like licenses.
--
Donovan Rebbechi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Buying computer parts ? How do you know which vendors to trust ?
http://www.resellerratings.com
Impartial and accurate. Straight from the buyers mouth.
( disclaimer: i'm not affiliated with resellerratings.com )
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: HELP YAMAHA YMF715E-S
Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 05:39:20 GMT
HI, Ive installed RedHat 5.3. Ive got a YAMAHA YMF715E-S(OPL3-SA3) sound card
integrated with my motherboard. Im unable to find the suitable drivers for
the same. If anybody has got the solution for the same , please help. Any
support is highly appreciated. Thanks SunilN
============= Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ============
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
------------------------------
From: "FM" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.os.linux.development.system,comp.os.linux.powerpc
Subject: Mac-emulation on Linux?
Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 22:47:08 -0700
I will attend a college this fall that is predominantly
Mac-oriented. While they state that Unix and Windows are
supported by the campus network, it seems that a Macintosh-
compatible system might be necessary to fully take
advantage of the system. For example, many softwares are
written for Macintosh by the faculty, the letter for last
year's computer purchase recommendation notes. I'm a little
disgruntled, as I have been planning on getting a Linux
system for college. So here are a couple of options I have:
1. Just buy a X86 machine and install Linux on it (if not
preinstalled). Get some Mac-emulation software if necessary.
The problem I have with this option is that I have no idea
about the availability of Mac-emulation softwares for Linux
nor the degree of compatibility they provide.
2. Buy a Macintosh and dual boot with Linux/MacOS
Well I think this is a nice compromise but I'm not sure how
well Linux runs on Macintosh. I'm fairly sure that it will
be an improvement over Windows/MacOS, but I'm not even sure
if most Linux softwares are available for this setup (or if
it's generally source-level compatible).
I think my doubts stem mostly from my lack of knowledge
about the Macintosh systems, which I've used before but
never administered. Are these the only options I have
considering that I want to use Linux and remain compatible
with Mac at the same time? Any additional information
would be apprecited. Thanks in advance.
Dan.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jesus Monroy, Jr.)
Crossposted-To: comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc
Subject: Re: Windows NT vs. Linux testing by mindcraft
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 05:06:45 GMT
On Sun, 2 May 1999 09:25:19 +0200, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pascal Gienger)
wrote:
>>else seems a compromise. MSFT wanted SGI people to use IE off a solaris
>>box.
>
>And now SGI smelled the money of "NT" and stops producing good workstations.
>All new SGIs come with NT...
>
None of the above. SGI is now in a fight for its survival.
I predicted this 5 years ago. With PCI and VESA, SCI no longer
has the market cornered on FAST graphics.
Evidence is:
For Linux
http://www.linuxjournal.com/issue46/2494.html
For FreeBSD
http://advocacy.freebsd.org/stories/pr_matrix.html
--
If you have to read the docs, it's broken.
I hate making mistakes.
You can check my spelling at: http://work.ucsd.edu:5141/cgi-bin/http_webster
------------------------------
From: Michael & Kyrstin Westwind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: How to upgrade Debian?
Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 23:04:35 -0700
Scott Banwart wrote:
> There a small handful of packages, like GNOME, Window Maker, and
Debian has a staging area for "unstable" GNOME packages. add the following
line to your sources.list file for apt and you will have access to them. I
use it without problem.
deb http://www.debian.org/~jim/debian-gtk-gnome/gnome-stage-slink unstable
main
Michael Westwind
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bill Unruh)
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.security.unix
Subject: Re: SUID games? What is RedHat doing?
Date: 3 May 1999 06:32:47 GMT
]On 3 May 1999 01:52:41 +0100, Lee Maguire <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
]wrote:
]>Bill Unruh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
]>>But of course there is nothing that makes sure that they can only be run
]>>on single user mode, or on a non-networked machine.
]>
]>Yes there is - it's called a system administrator.
]>
]>Perhaps your point is this: "well the person responsible for an
]>important multiuser system might install suid vga games because,
]>hey, they might want to use it for Quake or something" or "the
]>administrator might just install everything rather than selecting
]>the needed packages"
The point is that I for example have administered Unix system for over
10 years as an small adjunct to my main job doing research. The point is
that when I was given the opportunity to install, I did choose "games"
because sometimes my users might want to relax with some games. The
point is that there was no warning that some of the games were suid
root, and when I did a scan for suid root programs I suddenly found 6 of
them under games. The point is that I probably know and am more concious
of security than 80% of sysadmins out there, and these came as a shock
to me. Many people administering Unix machines, connected to the net, do
not even know how to find out whether or not they have suid root
programs running.
It is precisely my point that Redhat has put in trojans into their
distribution, that things put on for a lark can seriously comprimise the
security of the system, and that is unacceptable.
Of course now I know about them I can remove them. Any security hole can
be removed once you know about it. That is not the
point. The point is that the only way I got to know about them was by
accident. Games are NOT someplace I would look for security risks, and
for someone to put security risks there is not acceptable policy.
How many of you who are ponitificating here actually knew that some of
the games run as suid root?
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Chris Lee)
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.security.unix
Subject: Re: SUID games? What is RedHat doing?
Date: 3 May 1999 02:17:18 GMT
In article <7gio0r$bp5$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
>
>In <7gilll$n9i$[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Lee Maguire
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>>>With games this is especially dangerous, because security is
>>>probably the farthest thing from the minds of the game writer.
>>It certainly shouldn't be the top priority - I mean, they're GAMES!
>>If your mission-critical server is being used for Doom then I'd suggest
>>that the biggest security hole is in the wetware, not the software.
>
>They are programs which can be run by anyone, including anyone in the
>world who has managed to get user access to your system. Those suid root
>games would probably crash if run by blogs in Mongolia on your machine,
>but in the process could well give him root access. It is precisely
>because of mindsets like the one you just displayed ("tey're GAMES!...")
>That they are so dangerous. They are first and foremost programs, and
>as such are as dangerous as any suid lpr or sendmail. From a security
>standpoint it is irrelevant that they are games.
>
>>There are single-user Linux systems out there where a fast framerate in
>>Quake *is* more important than internal security - my home PC for one.
>
>But of course there is nothing that makes sure that they can only be run
>on single user mode, or on a non-networked machine.
Of course there is something that makes sure that they can only be run
on single user mode, or on a non-networked machine,moron.
It's called the person who's charge of the system....
------------------------------
From: Garen Parham <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Memory being limited to 16M
Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 19:48:27 -0700
Matthew R Ashe wrote:
> I have RedHat 5.2 with the 2.2.7 kernel. I noticed X was taking an
>
> extremly long time to bring up Netscape, as well as a few other programs.
>
> When I checked the system info, X reported there was 13M being used and 3M
>
> free. I actually have 128M memory. The system definitely seems to be
>
> swapping out. If I append mem=128M to lilo.conf or enter it at bootup, I
>
> get various messages telling me somthing is wrong and the system freezes.
>
> Take the line out, all is well. I am not a long time Linux user, I've
>
> mainly used NT 3 and NT4, play a few games on 98. I would love to say
>
> goodbye to MS on a more or less permanent basis, but so far I can't master
>
> Linux enough to get the things I need done day to day. I am getting a LOT
>
> closer though, and my programming (3 years college, no real world
>
> experience) is getting better. I am miffed how to get this seemingly
>
> simple problem fixed(it is simple, right???. Any help would greatly be
>
> appreciated.
>
> Thanks
>
> Matthew R Ashe
>
> PS I did compile the kernel to NOT limit the box to the 1st 16M ram.
>
>
You shouldn't have to add the append mem statement into lilo.conf, as 2.2.7
handle it properly, it was only needed with the older 2.0.x kernels (except
2.0.36). Try a cat /proc/meminfo and see what the MemTotal: line says. If
thats less than what you physically have installed, it's probably a problem
with your BIOS.
-Garen
-http://www.garen.net/
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (J.H.M. Dassen (Ray))
Subject: Re: md5sum - improvement?
Date: 3 May 1999 07:14:47 GMT
Herwig Huener & Josella Simone Playton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>(1) Are there two strings of non-zero-length and not equal to each other
>known to mankind, which have the same MD5-checksum (or "fingerprint")?
The capability of efficiently generating another string with the same
MD5-checksum as a given string would make MD5 useless.
As far as I know, noone has this capability yet. (Check
http://liinwww.ira.uka.de/bibliography/waisbib.html#search for "MD5" in
title for research regarding MD5).
>You see, where I am aiming to: to improve MD5
MD5 was designed as a one-way hash function for cryptographic use. A lot of
expertise, care and peer review is needed to be able to improve it in any
meaningful way.
If you are interested in doing this, I'd recommend starting with Bruce
Schneier, Applied Cryptography, 2nd ed.
(http://www.counterpane.com/applied.html) and the relevant FAQs like
http://www.faqs.org/faqs/cryptography-faq/snake-oil/
http://www.faqs.org/faqs/cryptography-faq/part01/
http://www.faqs.org/faqs/cryptography-faq/research/
HTH,
Ray
--
Tevens ben ik van mening dat Nederland overdekt dient te worden.
------------------------------
From: jason <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: XANIM and .avi files
Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 03:28:28 -0400
Stephen Speicher wrote:
...
> Thanks, Jason. This was very simple to do, and it worked well
> for 5.0 and 3.2, but for some reason I get this message for 4.1:
>
> XAnim Rev 2.80.0 by Mark Podlipec Copyright (C) 1991-1999. All Rights Reserved
> dlopen of /home/sjs/mmr/vid_iv41_1.0_linuxELFx86g21.xa failed: File not found.
>
> even though the file for 4.1 is there:
>
> mattcom.speicher.com> ls vi*
> vid_iv32_2.1_linuxELFx86g21.xa* vid_iv50_1.0_linuxELFx86g21.xa*
> vid_iv41_1.0_linuxELFx86g21.xa*
Hmm, I just tried running 'ldd' on my dll's, and it seems that all of
them are statically linked *except* for 4.1:
3:25:42 (/home/users/jason) jason% (cd /usr/local/xanim/mods/;ldd vid*)
vid_cvid_2.0_linuxELFx86.xa:
statically linked
vid_cyuv_1.0_linuxELFx86.xa:
statically linked
vid_h261_1.0_linuxELFx86.xa:
statically linked
vid_h263_1.0_linuxELFx86.xa:
statically linked
vid_iv32_2.1_linuxELFx86.xa:
statically linked
vid_iv41_1.1_linuxELFx86.xa:
libc.so.6 => /lib/libc.so.6 (0x4003b000)
/lib/ld-linux.so.2 => /lib/ld-linux.so.2 (0x2aaaa000)
vid_iv50_1.0_linuxELFx86.xa:
statically linked
3:26:32 (/home/users/jason) jason%
Try running 'ldd' against your copy of vid_iv41 to see what it's not finding.
-jason
(to reply via email, make the appropriate substitution in my email address)
------------------------------
From: "D. Vrabel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: md5sum - improvement?
Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 08:26:05 +0100
On Mon, 3 May 1999, Herwig Huener & Josella Simone Playton wrote:
> 1999-05-02 23:48:00 MEST
>
> Hi,
>
> two questions came up my mind:
>
> (1) Are there two strings of non-zero-length and not equal to each other
>
> known to mankind, which have the same MD5-checksum (or "fingerprint")?
Of course.
> (2) If I had two such strings, (not-equal to each other and having the
> same
> checksum,) I could subject both to some bit-operation, such as
> inversion,
> or xor-ing with a *.jpg of Pamela Anderson, or something like that. Then
>
> I could md5sum the two results. How large is the probability that these
> new
> MD5 checksums are also equal?
>
> You see, where I am aiming to: to improve MD5 by a simple algorithm
> which just calculates some derivative of a string, computes the
> MD5-sum of this derivative and append the result to the MD5 sum
> already obtained for the original. This way one can have a 256-bit,
> a 384-bit, a 512-bit etc. checksum - question is, is this checksum
> of higher quality than MD5 alone?
Your probably better of just have a longer checksum result.
David
--
David Vrabel
Engineering Undergraduate at University of Cambridge, UK.
------------------------------
From: Jeremy Weinberger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: nwu.comp.unix.linux,nwu.comp.misc
Subject: Re: StarOffice 5.0
Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 01:55:28 -0500
This means that you had to generate a separate license key for each
user, right?
jeremy
Sean Melody wrote:
>
> What? That is asinine...I installed as root and two other users use the
> program on my home computer...
>
> jason wrote:
> >
> > The way I got it to work as a user was to install it as that user. If I recall
> > correctly, only the user who installs it can run it.
> >
> > -jason
> >
> > (to reply via email, make the appropriate substitution in my email address)
------------------------------
From: Anup Rao <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: fetchmail
Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 16:49:35 -0400
I've just setup my linux system to read mail off of a POP server I use
fetchmail to get the mail from the server, but with every email that i
get, I also get a message from FETCHMAIL.DAEMON on my system that says:
Some of the addresses were rejected by the Mail Delivery Agent that
Fetchmail forwards to.
My guess is that the MDA doesn't know what to do with mail that was
originally addressed to my acme account.... because I don't get this error
message when I send mail to an account on my computer (user@localhost).
Can someon please tell me how to fix it?
Any replies are appreciated.
********
Anup Rao
GT
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
The world trembled 'neath the giant's feet, but some things did not shake.
For standing by, with wrath in his eye, was one that the giant could not
take.
They shook hands, were pleased to meet.
The gunslinger drew. Pleased he was not.
!End.
########
------------------------------
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.linux.advocacy,gnu.misc.discuss
Subject: Re: GNU reeks of Communism
From: Michael Powe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 03 May 1999 01:01:39 -0700
=====BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE=====
Hash: SHA1
>>>>> "Chris" == Chris Welch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> read it on slashdot. ESR quickly said that he had *no*
>> intenvions for physical violence whatsoever.
Chris> Of course he would say that, anyone in that situation
Chris> would. I believe him, but just because someone says that,
Chris> doesn't mean it's true. At any rate, we don't need one of
Chris> the big names to go around threatening people (empty or
Chris> not). -- - http://www.olemiss.edu/~cmwelch1 --
Chris> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
The false notion that Raymond had threatened Perens with violence was
first propagated by Perens in response to a statement from Raymond
that Perens interpreted to mean that Raymond might shoot him. Perens
subsequently retracted his interpretation of Raymond's statements and
admitted he had misunderstood them. You guys really should pay more
attention to what's going on ... even if it means less time spent
gossipping about what you don't know.
mp
- --
powered by GNU/linux since Sept 1997
[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.trollope.org
Michael Powe Portland, Oregon USA
"Would John the Baptist have lost his head if his name was Steve?"
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------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Matthias Warkus)
Subject: Re: Gnome Help !
Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 20:13:35 +0200
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
It was the Sun, 02 May 1999 09:52:57 -0400...
..and -bill- <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm even more of a nubie than you are, what is GNOME ?
A huge software package that makes Unix more user-friendly. It
consists of:
- an extremely nice panel with nice panel applets
- a control center
- a very nice drag-n-drop file manager
- several utilities
- (soon) an object model
- ...lots of stuff like that...
For developers:
- an application development framework for several programming
languages
It's entirely themable and, believe me, very cool. I've got a couple
of high-quality screenshots of Gnome, if you want it, I can send you
them.
mawa
--
If I have seen further than others, it is because I stood on the
shoulders of giants. -- Sir Isaac Newton
If I have seen further than others, it is because I am surrounded by
dwarfs. -- Murray Gell-Mann (a.k.a. Mr. Humility)
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Matthias Warkus)
Crossposted-To: comp.unix.admin,comp.unix.questions
Subject: Re: Alpha Server + WinNT + DOS progs???
Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 20:11:23 +0200
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
It was the 2 May 1999 17:17:02 GMT...
..and Charles Demas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >On 1999-05-02 [EMAIL PROTECTED] said:
> > >Hi Everybody !
> > >My question;
> > >On my job I have a ALPHA server running UNIX,
> > >is it possible to change that to a WinNT server running DOS
> > >programs ??
> >Why on earth would you want to?
>
> My guess is one or more of the following:
>
> 1. He has no Unix experience.
> 2. He wants to do a web-server with M$ Frontpage or other M$ stuff.
> 3. He likes being called when the system misbehaves.
> 4. He's a troll.
>
> My bet is on number 4.
AOL, mine too (the "DOS programs" indicate this).
mawa
--
If I have seen further than others, it is because I stood on the
shoulders of giants. -- Sir Isaac Newton
If I have seen further than others, it is because I am surrounded by
dwarfs. -- Murray Gell-Mann (a.k.a. Mr. Humility)
------------------------------
From: "S�ren Klintrup" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc
Subject: Re: The Best Linux distribution? (was Re: FreeBSD vs. Linux)
Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 10:04:18 +0200
But it wasn't the elevator that crashed, it was on 3rd floor .... you just
made a mistake, recompile the kernel and try again :)
/S�ren
Tom Christiansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> [courtesy cc of this posting sent to cited author via email]
>
> In comp.os.linux.misc, Mikhail Kruk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> :> Take a look at those man pages. There isn't much that could be
> :> taken out of the BSD pages if you want anything useable. I felt
> :> the implication was that the Linux was very undocumented.
> :>
> :> The docs look identical to my printed 4.4BSD manuals from the
> :> Usenix/OReilly work.
> :
> :can't agree more
> :Linux never stops surprising me with its man pages
>
> And not the kind of surprise that comes from opening a carefully wrapped
> package to find it full of tasty chocolates, either. Rather, it seems
> more that kind of surprise that comes from having stepped through an
> open elevator door only to realize belatedly that no elevator awaits you.
>
> --tom
> --
> "there is not enough floorspace for all the stuff I want to put on
> it" -- Dean Roehrich's (only) complaint about his cubicle
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rob Komar)
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.security.unix
Subject: Re: SUID games? What is RedHat doing?
Date: 3 May 1999 08:09:16 GMT
Bill Unruh ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: It is precisely my point that Redhat has put in trojans into their
: distribution, that things put on for a lark can seriously comprimise the
: security of the system, and that is unacceptable.
: Of course now I know about them I can remove them. Any security hole can
: be removed once you know about it. That is not the
: point. The point is that the only way I got to know about them was by
: accident. Games are NOT someplace I would look for security risks, and
: for someone to put security risks there is not acceptable policy.
:
: How many of you who are ponitificating here actually knew that some of
: the games run as suid root?
These games are such an obvious security threat that they have been
gone over with a fine-toothed comb years ago. As proof of this, check
out how many security notices about SVGALIB executables have been released
over the last few years. You would be safer deleting NFS, sendmail,
pop mail and imap daemon from your system.
I'm not being flippant about this. You have to be sitting at the console
to run these executables. If potential crackers are sitting at your
console, then you've got bigger problems (like are the cdrom or floppy
mountable by anybody, does `linux single' give them root privileges
at boot time, do they have boot/root floppies, can they remove the
hard drives?). The SVGALIB executables only need a root effective UID
when they're tinkering with the video card. If written properly, they
only use the root effective UID when toying with the display; otherwise
they run under the real UID. The SVGALIB executables are more dangerous
than programs that don't have the root SUID bits set; but not by much.
So, serious multi-user systems shouldn't have these games installed on
them, but having them isn't as bad as you may think.
Cheers,
Rob Komar
------------------------------
From: ms <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Where can I find libncurses.so.3.0 ?
Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 23:19:38 +0000
Hi,
Where can I find the library libncurses.so.3.0 necessary to install
isdn4k-utils-2.0-2.i386.rpm ?
(I have a redHat 5.2 system)
Thanks in advance.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Floyd Davidson)
Crossposted-To:
talk.politics.misc,comp.os.linux.advocacy,alt.activism,alt.society.liberalism
Subject: Re: The GNU Fragrance of Sharing vs. the Stench of Greed (was: GNU reeks of
Communism (really)
Date: 3 May 1999 08:34:00 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Chris Costello <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>In article <7gjac1$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Floyd Davidson wrote:
>>
>> I can't "prove" anything if you can't read and comprehend the two
>> license agreements.
>>
>> The BSD license does not prevent a totally proprietary, closed,
>> use of code. GPL does.
>
> That's the down side.
>
> Unfortunately, you missed a vital part. "must reproduce the
>above copyright" and the "above copyright" happens to include
>"Copyright (c) [year] [your name]"
No I didn't miss that, but I'm not imparting any significance to
it either, which you seem to be doing.
If you write a proprietary program, using code covered under the
BSD license, and dutifully arrange for somewhere in the program
to have said copyright notice displayed, what significance does
it have? Nobody knows what part of the program it applies to.
Nobody knows what benefits or detriments the code has provided.
Nobody knows what neato (or horrible) adjustments were made to
the code to adapt it for use.
Nobody benefits from it except the greedy bastard that won't
share the his program with anyone else!
So what benefit is there to anybody other than said GB. It
doesn't help advance the state of the art, since nobody gets to
see whatever advance was made. Nobody else can build on it and
go the next step farther. It is a dead end for that code.
On the other hand, if the included code had been under the GPL,
and the license agreement was kept, said GB becomes
Mr. Wonderful and has the potential to advance the state of the
art by helping everyone.
The GPL succeeds where the BSD license fails. There is no
instance where the BSD succeeds and the GPL fails, because
by definition making Free code proprietary is a failure.
Floyd
--
Floyd L. Davidson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
North Slope images: <http://www.ptialaska.net/~floyd>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (LEBLANC ERIC)
Subject: Re: The GNU Fragrance of Sharing vs. the Stench of Greed (was: GNU reeks of
Communism (really)
Crossposted-To:
talk.politics.misc,comp.os.linux.advocacy,alt.activism,alt.society.liberalism
Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 07:29:51 GMT
Chris Costello ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, D.
:Vrabel wrote:
: > On Sun, 2 May 1999, Chris Costello wrote:
: >
: > > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Mark S. Bilk wrote:
: > > > >For each person, it depends on timescale or personal
: > > > >interest. Some systems elevate a "class" of individuals to take
: > > > >advantage of others ("practical communism" and GPL),
: > > >
: > > > Amazing! Exactly what "class of individuals" is enabled
: > > > to "take advantage of others" by means of the GPL? All of
: > > > humanity minus Bill Gates?
: > >
: > > The GPL is a crock. It forces openness. That's not freedom.
: > > You like walking outside sometimes, I would bet. Would you like
: > > being *FORCED* to walk outside all the time? That's the key
: > > problem with the GPL and many recognize it.
:
: > Alas, your argument is wrong because your not forced to use the GPL or
: > to use GPL software.
:
: I'm completely aware. I don't like developing on software
: that makes me release all of my code. If I want to, say, use an
: IRC server that's GPLed, and add my proprietary extensions to it
: for conferences amongst my coworkers, I can't do that, now, can
: I?
Yes, you can. If you don't distribute it. What the GPL grant you
is the right to modify the program and the obligation to grant the
same right to the persons or organisations that you distribute the
software to.
If you make proprietary extensions to an existing server and use it
in house. You don't have to release any code to anyone...but if you
distribute it to friends/customers/etc, you have to grant them the
same rights to modify the software that you had with the original work.
It is tit for tat. The cost of not reinventing the wheel comes at
the price that you can't denie your customers the right to modify
the source that you had originaly. Is that fair? It certainly is
IMHO.
If you don't want anyone to see your code, well, start from scratch or
use code that allow you to do so.
E.
------------------------------
From: Zdravko Balorda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Xfree Matrox Mil
Date: 3 May 1999 09:13:49 GMT
: You need to get the latest XFree86, 3.3.3.1. I have a Mystique G200 AGP running
: like a dream here.
Could you send me your XF86Config? All I get is builtin 320x200 mode.
Thanks, Zdravko.
------------------------------
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