Linux-Misc Digest #761, Volume #21 Sat, 11 Sep 99 06:13:08 EDT
Contents:
Re: Q? - best combo of linux distrib and apps for 3rd world (DeAnn Iwan)
EPSON Stylus 740 & NEC SuperScript 860 Printers w/ RH 6.0 (Thomas Wang)
Re: General Rant from a Linux Newbie (Anthony Ord)
Re: "autoexec.bat"-type service in Linux? (Villy Kruse)
Re: Absurd Linux mentality ! (Steve Lamb)
Re: URGENT - tar question (Robert Nichols)
Re: Linux System Labs (Richard Steiner)
C++ clear screen command ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: General Rant from a Linux Newbie (Darren Winsper)
Re: Amiga, QNX, Linux and Revolution (Bill Rizzi)
Re: Modem Lights applet (Owen Cook)
Re: General Rant from a Linux Newbie (Anthony Ord)
Re: How do you pronounce Linux? (Tom Bunger)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (DeAnn Iwan)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.linux.admin,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.os.linux.hardware,comp.os.linux.help,comp.os.linux.questions
Subject: Re: Q? - best combo of linux distrib and apps for 3rd world
Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 09:06:09 GMT
On Wed, 08 Sep 1999 22:00:17 GMT, Allan L. Brown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>I am looking for the best combination of distribution, configuration and
>office productivity apps with the following goal.
>
>- Reasonable performance on 486-33, 16 MB Ram, <400 MB HD.
>- All software free.
>- apps appropriate for NON-Technical end users need to do wordprocessing,
>
>spreadsheet, email, web browsing, and callandering.
>- apps not dead (ie: old versions with no future or new development)
>
>I am doing this as a pet project to see if it is feasible to use linux
>and linux available apps to distribute to non-profit workers in 3rd world
>
>countries where $$$ and hdwr are scarce.
>
>I am currently testing on 486-100 AMD, 20 MB Ram, 500 MB HD.
>
Since I have several 486s configured, I thought I'd reply.
Most distributions will configure and run on a 486 with 16 MB RAM and
<400 MB HD. The slower 486s, especially those without any kind of
video card upgrade, will seem slow running X to anyone used to PIIIs
and higher end machines. You need about 200 MB RAM to configure most
with X, and another 100 or so for an office suite (I think StarOffice
is 70 MB, but that might be compressed). I'd suggest you go to one of
the cheap cd sellers, like cheapbytes or linux systems labs and buy
one of their GPL packs of half a dozen distros. Try them on your
machine, and configure with Star Office. (Sun is selling the bare CD
for $10 now, and many full distros already have it aboard as an rpm.)
I'd recommend an rpm distro, since that is the dominant form.
So it will be easiest for people to import files to.
If you are working with a nonprofit organization, you may be
able to work out some kind of a support deal with one of the major
distributions. Obviously, they will not want to give millions of
users free support. They have to eat, too. But once you settle on
what you want to distribute, it's worth checking with them to see if
some special arrangement can be worked out for some kind of support to
some of your sites.
------------------------------
From: Thomas Wang <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: EPSON Stylus 740 & NEC SuperScript 860 Printers w/ RH 6.0
Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 02:01:45 -0700
Dear gurus,
If someone could help me with configuring EPSON Stylus 740 color inkjet
and NEC SuperScript 860 monochrome laserjet to work with Redhat Linux
6.0, and hopefully get the best printing results, I would greatly
appreciate that! Both printers connect to the parallel ports of the
PCs. Neither printer appears in the supported printer list at RH 6.0
installation time. My guess is to copy some configuration files that
work, and I'm here to learn!
Thank you.
Tee
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Anthony Ord)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: General Rant from a Linux Newbie
Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 09:04:00 GMT
On Thu, 9 Sep 1999 14:40:20 -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (teknite) wrote:
>What is dselect?
>Sounds like something I would be interested in.
It's the package manager/selector that comes with Debian (and soon Caldera).
A brief tour (apologies for the look - it's Win95 terminal, 'nuff said)
================>
Debian Linux `dselect' package handling frontend.
0. [A]ccess Choose the access method to use.
1. [U]pdate Update list of available packages, if possible.
2. [S]elect Request which packages you want on your system.
* 3. [I]nstall Install and upgrade wanted packages.
4. [C]onfig Configure any packages that are unconfigured.
5. [R]emove Remove unwanted software.
6. [Q]uit Quit dselect.
Use ^P and ^N, cursor keys, initial letters, or digits to select;
Press ENTER to confirm selection. ^L to redraw screen.
Version 1.4.1.6 (i386 elf). Copyright (C) 1994-1996 Ian Jackson. This is
free software; see the GNU General Public Licence version 2 or later for
copying conditions. There is NO warranty. See dselect --licence for details.
<-----------------
I choose select and go looking for "KDE" stuff with the search.
Here I have my cursor over kdegames, which I don't have selected on my machine
- note the description below.
=======================>
EIOM Pri Section Package Inst.ver Avail.ver Description
== Opt contrib/ pike-crypto- <none> 1.0.0-7 Build only package for
bu
------- Available Extra packages in section contrib/devel -------
== Xtr contrib/ kdevelop <none> 1.0beta1-1 An IDE for Unix/X11
------- Available Extra packages in section contrib/games -------
== Xtr contrib/ kdegames <none> 1.1.1-19990 KDE games collection
== Xtr contrib/ kdetoys <none> 1.1.1-19990 some toys for the KDE
== Xtr contrib/ sarien <none> 0.4.4-1 An interprenter for AGI
r
------- Available Extra packages in section contrib/graphics -------
== Xtr contrib/ gxanim <none> 0.02a-1 GTK frontend to xanim
== Xtr contrib/ kdegraphics <none> 1.1.1-19990 KDE collection of
graphic
== Xtr contrib/ picon-domain <none> 1999.08.11- Picon (Personal Images)
d
kdegames not installed; hold (was: hold). Extra
kdegames - KDE games collection
This is a collection of several games written for kde.
kabalone - Abalone Board Game kasteroids - Asteroids kblackbox - Logic game
kmahjongg - Mahjongg kmines - Minesweeper konquest - Gnu-Lactic Konquest
kpat - Patience kpoker - Poker kreversi - Reversi (or Othello) game ksame -
SameGame kshisen - Shisen-Sho ksirtet - tetris clone ksmiletris - tetris
based game ksnake - Snake Game ksokoban - Sokoban
<--------------------
Hit "+", and it detects some dependencies...
=====================>
Help: Introduction to conflict/dependency resolution sub-list
Dependency/conflict resolution - introduction.
One or more of your choices have raised a conflict or dependency problem -
some packages should only be installed in conjunction with certain others, and
some combinations of packages may not be installed together.
You will see a sub-list containing the packages involved. The bottom half of
the display shows relevant conflicts and dependencies; use `i' to cycle
between
that, the package descriptions and the internal control information.
A set of `suggested' packages has been calculated, and the initial markings in
this sub-list have been set to match those, so you can just hit Return to
accept the suggestions if you wish. You may abort the change(s) which caused
the problem(s), and go back to the main list, by pressing capital `X'.
You can also move around the list and change the markings so that they are
more
like what you want, and you can `reject' my suggestions by using the capital
`D' or `R' keys (see the keybindings help screen). You can use capital `Q' to
force me to accept the situation currently displayed, in case you want to
override a recommendation or think that the program is mistaken.
<-----------------
I get past that help screen...
==================>
EIOM Pri Section Package Description
=* Xtr contrib/ kdegames KDE games collection
=* Xtr contrib/ kdelibs2g KDE core libraries (runtime files)
=* Xtr non-free kdesupport0g mime, uuencode and QwSpriteField library -
runtim
== Opt contrib/ kdebase KDE core applications
<snip whitespace>
kdegames not installed; install (was: hold). Extra
kdegames depends on kdelibs2g (>= 1.1.1-19990822-1.0)
kdegames depends on kdesupport0g (>= 1.1.1-19990822-1)
kdegames suggests kdebase
<---------------
Hmm, kdegames depends on kdelibs2g - exactly how big is that? Select it and
hit "I".
================>
Package: kdelibs2g
Priority: extra
Section: contrib/libs
Installed-Size: 4700
Maintainer: Stephan Kulow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Architecture: i386
Source: kdelibs
Version: 4:1.1.2-19990906-1.0
Provides: kdelibs
Depends: libc6 (>= 2.1), libstdc++2.10, qt1g (>= 1.44-1), xlib6g (>= 3.3.4-1),
available version of control info for kdelibs2g -- 62%, press d for more.
<pressed d>
Filename:
dists/potato/kde/binary-i386/libs/kdelibs2g_1.1.2-19990906-1.0_i386.de
Size: 1668910
MD5sum: b1ea41fb399f13be7f6ffa7677202c26
Description: KDE core libraries (runtime files)
KDE core libraries.
You need these files to run kde applications.
<-------------------
One point six meg!? I haven't even looked at the other stuff! I think I'll
skip installing KDE until the weekend (cheaper per minute). "R" to restore old
settings (i.e. before I selected KDE games) and enter to confirm.
I press enter again to get to the main menu, then select "install" to do stuff
I was already installing before the KDE shock.
===================>
Processing status file...
Processing Package files...
192.168.2.4 dists/unstable/main...
192.168.2.4 dists/unstable/non-free...
192.168.2.4 dists/unstable/contrib...
192.168.2.4 dists/stable/non-US...
192.168.2.4 dists/potato/contrib...
192.168.2.4 dists/potato/kde...
192.168.2.4 dists/potato/rkrusty...
Constructing list of files to get...
want: 192.168.2.4 dists/unstable/non-free/.../graphics/libgd-perl_1.18-2.1.deb
(81k)
want: 192.168.2.4
dists/unstable/main/.../interpreters/libdevel-symdump-perl_2.00-4.deb (13k)
want: 192.168.2.4 dists/unstable/main/.../web/libapache-mod-perl_1.21-4.deb
(596k)
want: 192.168.2.4 dists/unstable/non-free/.../x11/xsnow_1.40-6.deb (18k)
Approximate total space required: 708k
Available space in debian: 21301k
Do you want to select the files to get [n]:
Do you want to download the required files [y]:
<---------------------
The 192.168.2.4 is my win95 machine which I am using as a proxy (I have a
winmodem).
If I hit enter here (Y is the default), it will get the files and download
them, install them, then configure them. But I'm off-line right now, and I
don't want to go on-line, so I won't.
As easy as that.
There is a graphical "GUI" as well, but I don't use it, and besides people
would have bitched (more than they do anyway) if I'd posted binaries.
>Thanks,
> teknite
Regards
Anthony
--
=========================================
| And when our worlds |
| They fall apart |
| When the walls come tumbling in |
| Though we may deserve it |
| It will be worth it - Depeche Mode |
=========================================
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Villy Kruse)
Subject: Re: "autoexec.bat"-type service in Linux?
Date: 11 Sep 1999 11:09:17 +0200
Jeffrey C. Dege <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>What I'd like to add is that versions of Redhat prior to 6.0 would
>overwrite the contents of /etc/motd at boot. This was done in
>/etc/rc.d/rc.local, if I remember correctly.
Actualy you didn't remember correctly, but almost. rc.local will modify
/etc/issue at boot time and this also takes place on RH60.
--
Villy
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Steve Lamb)
Subject: Re: Absurd Linux mentality !
Date: 11 Sep 1999 08:29:53 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Fri, 10 Sep 1999 21:50:52 -0400, Christopher R. Carlen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>> My heading is a bit extreme - perhaps ?
>> Linux users who are proud that they learned what:
>> " cd /home; tar cvpf - * | ( cd /newhome; tar xvpf - ) "
>> means; don't yet realise that knowledge of this arbitrary syntax, will be of
>> no use to them in 10 years time.
>There is something about command line control over my computer, that I
Isn't there? I mean, why do that at all? How about
cd /home; tar cpf - * | tar xpf -o /newhome -
(IIRC)
The cd is superfulous, however. ;)
--
Steve C. Lamb | I'm your priest, I'm your shrink, I'm your
ICQ: 5107343 | main connection to the switchboard of souls.
===============================+=============================================
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Robert Nichols)
Subject: Re: URGENT - tar question
Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 01:05:49 GMT
Note: E-mailed *and* posted.
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Stephen Waite <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
:I have been unable to get to the other tar files.
:
:I cannot move past the position the tape was at when it was powered off in the
:hope that it would not write an EOD.
:
:Any other ideas?.
:
:
:Stephen Waite wrote:
:
:> The tape drive is a AIWA GD-E8000.
Sounds like you need the services of a data recovery firm. I don't know
diddly squat about that model, so I can't help.
--
Bob Nichols [EMAIL PROTECTED]
PGP public key 1024/9A9C7955
Key fingerprint = 2F E5 82 F8 5D 06 A2 59 20 65 44 68 87 EC A7 D7
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Richard Steiner)
Subject: Re: Linux System Labs
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 01:40:11 -0500
Here in comp.os.linux.misc, Conway Yee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
spake unto us, saying:
>Why would anyone WANT 4-5 different distributions? Most are variants on
>a theme. Few, if anyone, uses multiple distributions. You pays your
>money and takes your choice.
For one, using several different distributions is a very good way to
discover which distribution is best suited to your particular tastes.
--
-Rich Steiner >>>---> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>---> Bloomington, MN
OS/2 + Linux + BeOS + FreeBSD + Solaris + WinNT4 + Win95 + DOS
+ VMWare + Fusion + vMac + Executor = PC Hobbyist Heaven! :-)
AND, it frees my palm to do other things!
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: C++ clear screen command
Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 09:17:41 GMT
Hello!
I'm new in C++ programming and I'm using the g++ compiler with SUSE
Linux 6.1
I'm trying to make a clear screen command before starting my programs
but I can't find how.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
In case this is not the correct newsgroup to post questions like this,
please send me a valid newsgroup in order not to bother you again.
Thanks a lot.
Apostolis
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Darren Winsper)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: General Rant from a Linux Newbie
Date: 11 Sep 1999 08:07:06 GMT
On 10 Sep 1999 17:28:32 -0400, David Meyers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Unfortunately, their FAQ says
> that they believe that "the graphical interface of Linux
> is not very good (compared to the Mac)" and want to
> focus on the mac in the next few months.
Well, you could ask them "which ones?" and see what sort of responce
you get...
--
Darren Winsper - http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/darren.winsper
Stellar Legacy project member - http://www.stellarlegacy.tsx.org
Java leads to Javascript. Javascript leads to Shockwave. Shockwave leads
to . . . suffering.
------------------------------
From: Bill Rizzi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.qnx,comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Re: Amiga, QNX, Linux and Revolution
Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1999 09:49:05 -0700
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Terje Trane wrote:
> I can't really remember the details but I think CP/M had a consept of
> User, where all files on a diskette was in a non hieractic directory,
> but owned by a user (defalt 0). Then you could change to User 1
> (or 2 or 3...) and have a new clean directory where you could put
> files even with the same name.
>
> Or am I mixing up systems here?
Nope, you've got it right for the most part. I could drag my
CP/M-based Kaypro 10 out of the garage, but I'll rely on memory for the
moment; it's only been retired for 3 years. By the way, I never filled
up the 10MB disk, even after a decade+ of use! OK, it was mostly a
vt-100 emulator for the last five or so years of its lifetime ...
I believe the hard disk had two partitions (A and B ?) each of which
had about 10 user areas.
Z
--
Bill Rizzi [EMAIL PROTECTED] Software Services
Z http://www.softserv.com/~rizzi Santa Barbara, CA
FAX: (630) 982-5338
------------------------------
From: Owen Cook <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Modem Lights applet
Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 18:12:17 +1000
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Wed, 08 Sep 1999 18:02:51 +1000, Timothy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>For my 'Modem Lights' applet, I've put 'ifup ppp0' to connect and that
>works fine. I've also put 'ifdown ppp0' for disconnect, but this
>doesn't seem to work. Any ideas on how to fix this? Thanks... :)
I have the same problem, but can use ppp-off to do the disconnect, all
very interesting
Owen
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Anthony Ord)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: General Rant from a Linux Newbie
Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 09:03:58 GMT
On Fri, 10 Sep 1999 08:20:27 -0700, K. Bjarnason
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
>> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451
X-Newsreader bigot! X-Newsreader bigot! X-Newsreader bigot!
You always get them when they have nothing else to say...
>> On Mon, 6 Sep 1999 14:16:04 -0700, K. Bjarnason
>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> >[snips]
>> >
>> >In article <7r16ji$ec7$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >says...
>> >> K. Bjarnason ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
>> >> : > tar -C / -xzvf foo.tar.gz
>> >>
>> >> : Now, now, let's not be silly. Compare this to a typical Win9x
>> >> : distribution. (Speaking here of installable end-user apps, not data
>> >> : files, etc.)
>> >>
>> >> I suppose you're not talking about downloading and compiling source, then?
>> >
>> >I'm playing end-user here; of course not. :)
>> >
>> >
>> >> You know, if you had a clue about any of this, you'd realize that it is
>> >> usually source that is packaged in tarballs.
>> >
>> >Golly gee, like I didn't know that. I also happen to know that out of
>> >the times I've downloaded apps for Linux that weren't part of the
>> >distribution package they usually came as... source.
>> >
>> >> Debian and RedHat have
>> >> developed some nice package management systems for installing compiled
>> >> applications. If a user is scared of decompressing and untar'ing a file,
>> >> how do you think he'll feel about compiling it? He'd best stick with
>> >> packages.
>> >
>> >Indeed. Now, of the package systems available, which is the standard
>> >one? Or even three?
>>
>> --- START INSERT ---
>>
>> On Mon, 6 Sep 1999 11:40:37 -0700, K. Bjarnason
>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> >The two major ways of distributing Win9* native apps is to either stuff
>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>
>> >them into ZIP files or to packagae them as self-extracting EXE files.
>>
>> --- END INSERT ---
>>
>> and you haven't even covered the "minor" ways of distributing apps.
>>
>> People who live in glass houses should not throw stones.
>
>I notice you failed to include the one - or even three - standardized
>methods Linux uses. No, not Debian or whatever other distro - *Linux*.
Linux is only a kernel. You can't install packages into just the kernel. You
can't even log on to just the kernel.
>With Windows, as long as I know two methods, I can install the vast
>majority of my applications,
"Vast majority"? that's a little equivocable isn't it?
>regardless of what Windows box I'm sitting
>at.
Really? Now the last thing I tried, setup.exe (wsextract) didn't work on
Windows 3.0 - kept complaining - what was your method for overcoming that?
>Now, for Linux, show me the two methods I can use - regardless of
>the Linux box or distro - to accomplish the same feat.
To "I can install the vast majority of my applications, regardless of what
<expletive deleted> box I'm sitting at?" - ok.
1/ In mc you select the file, your package contents comes up and you select
"install"- well actually "INSTALL" (it's case sensitive).
And another way....hmm, well if you don't like the above for whatever reason,
you could try,
2/ alien -i <name>
But usually there should be no need.
>Hmm... someone said "glass houses"?
Yes - me.
>> You mean you have to download first with Windows? My that sounds hard. How
>> would you do that then? Does it support re-getting the file when the link
>> dies?
>
>Depends on the client, doesn't it?
You mean you have clients for downloading applications that don't? How
primitive.
>> How do you know which version of DirectX your download requires?
>
>If an application requires a version of Direct X, the web page you
>downloaded it from - or its readme, if you're doing it locally - will
>tell you.
So you rely on the person hosting the site remembering that it is important to
you? It isn't automatic? How primitive.
>> How do you
>> know that it doesn't need IE4 which you have sworn will not touch your
>> machine?
>
>IE4? Funny; can't recall _ever_ seeing an app which required IE4.
Eudora. We've had this denial before. If you look it up in De ja News, you can
trot out the old excuses as well.
>Then
>again, if the app requires IE4, and you don't want IE4, then don't use
>the app. Gee, that wasn't too hard, was it?
But "if the app requires IE4, and you don't want IE4, then don't *download*
the app." obviously *was* too hard wasn't it? Perhaps somebody should show
Microsoft a clue about the internet - where downed connections and limited
bandwidth are all too common.
>Oh, you need that app? Fine; quit whining. If you need the app, then
>your personal disklike of IE4 isn't really relevant, is it?
It's not my personal dislike of IE4, it more the fact it breaks IE5. If it had
been my personal dislikes, then it would have been IE > 3, or the IEs that
think they're an OS and not a HTML browser.
>> Hard to use, fragile and crap - the Microsoft Windows Experience.
>
>Easy to use, rock-solid (at least the NT flavours) and fun - the Windows
>experience.
>
>Yes, I know, it doesn't like the sort of $1.99 hardware people who can
>only afford a free OS will typically throw at it; then again, if you're
>worried about stability, you shouldn't be trying to run on crap
>hardware. Get a real machine.
I have got a real machine thanks. I bought it when I could afford such
luxuries. The only non-real part of it is my winmodem.
>That, by the way, is serious advice, not some pointless jab. I've seen
>a few - very few - unstable NT installs, and so far, they're almost
>exclusively due to crap hardware. Given decent - and we're not talking
>top-of-the-line here, just in proper working order - equipment, and NT
>has always, in my experience, run rock-solid.
The problem is recognising such hardware. I have heard "issues" about SB Live!
cards and SMP. Neither of which are scraping the barrel hardware-wise.
>Yeah, Win9x are somewhat less so - then again, if stability is your
>concern, which it is or you wouldn't be whining about "fragile" - then
>you're not running Win9x in the first place.
No, I'm demonstrating that the One Microsoft Way has been overtaken and needs
to start running if it is going to stand a chance in hell of catching up.
Regards
Anthony
--
=========================================
| And when our worlds |
| They fall apart |
| When the walls come tumbling in |
| Though we may deserve it |
| It will be worth it - Depeche Mode |
=========================================
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tom Bunger)
Subject: Re: How do you pronounce Linux?
Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 07:51:27 GMT
Personally, I pronounce it "LINN-ux" (with a short i)
Linus Torvalds gives his $.02 in this sound file:
ftp://ftp.linux.org/pub/kernel/SillySounds/english.au
-Tom Bunger
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (NF
Stevens) wrote:
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Lew Pitcher) wrote:
>
>>I pronounce it "Fred", but that's just me ;-)
>
>But is that a long or a short e?
>
>Norman
------------------------------
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End of Linux-Misc Digest
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