Linux-Misc Digest #592, Volume #25 Mon, 28 Aug 00 02:13:04 EDT
Contents:
Re: Linux, XML, and assalting Windows ("paul snow")
Re: Linux, XML, and assalting Windows ("paul snow")
Re: Check out this weird linux behavior (Bill Unruh)
Re: From RedHat to SuSE: A simple question ("Sly")
Re: From RedHat to SuSE: A simple question ("Sly")
Re: Advice sought, (new user coming from OS/2) (Richard Steiner)
Re: Linux, XML, and assalting Windows ("paul snow")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "paul snow" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.text.xml,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux, XML, and assalting Windows
Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 05:26:10 GMT
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:8o9s07$c3b$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> paul snow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:mZTp5.18778$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> > Today we have Java VMs and Adobe Acrobat viewers, and browsers, and
> browser
> > plug-ins, word processing packages, and stock tickers, Internet based
> games,
> > etc. Never mind that we are going to be configuring systems to connect
> with
> > other systems, and use databases, and database clients, and we need to
set
> > up security, and down load the new versions of our clients, etc.
> >
> > It isn't going to be simple in the future. It is going to get worse.
In
> > another post I list a set of requirements we are going to need from a
> > package manager. Not want, need. Typewriters are out for good. And
> > Redmond may be at fault to some degree, but if so they only pushed us
> ahead
> > in time a bit. It was going to happen to us anyway.
> >
> > We have to have package managers, but they need to be based on open
> > standards.
>
> Are you saying that the Linux package managers are not open?
No. But I don't have an open standard for describing software so that I can
express that software onto any platform its description claims it supports.
> > And they need to operate in an environment outside the execution
> > environment of the supported computer systems. They need to be able to
> > manage cross platform, distributed applications.
> Just what do you mean by that? It sound like a lot of empty talk devoid
of
> real meaning.
Distributed applications mean that to get the distributed application to
run, I have to get a number of applications installed and configured,
usually across a range of platforms, and integrated with firewalls, etc.
Today I do that with sometimes great programs (like the RPM) and sometimes
with less great facilities (like Install Shield). But I have to manually
install and configure each component, often in an exact order. I have
databases, database clients, compilers, web servers, object request brokers
of various sorts, etc. that all have their own sets of needed tweaks based
on the topology we are setting up.
All of that just to get the right abstractions up and running so we can
begin to talk about setting up and configuring the actual application.
That is what I mean when I say we need to be able to manage cross platform
distributed applications. Today we have given up on client side
distributed applications. Involving the client in all of this seems like it
is just too difficult. But look at the promises! Many of the applications
we are predicting require client side intelligence. And even the ones that
don't are passing up on lots of CPU cycles that would greatly improve their
performance. All because we can't deliver and manage software.
>
> > Why? Because we are on
> > the Internet already!
>
> What does that have to do with software installation procedures?
The Internet means distributed applications. And internet delivered
software. Transient software (applications that install, you use for a
while, then they go away.)
Take one of many examples:
Say that I want to be able, as an Application Service Provider (ASP), to
deliver native code to my clients. But today I can't because I can't manage
all the combinations of possible configuration issues that my customers are
going to encounter if I deliver software the way we do today. As an ASP I
become responsible. If I try to push this responsibility off onto the
specific Application Developer, they are simply going blame the problem on
one or more of the other venders that delivered software to this customer.
But if instead I am providing XML described software, then this
responsibility to deal with these combinations shifts to the vender of the
Software Rendering Facility the customer is using. But unlike the ASP, the
Facility vender deals with this day in and day out for all their customers
(a set much larger than the ASPs). And doing so is part of their value add.
Furthermore, part of their value add is assuring the customer they can
cleanly remove the new software if no repair for the installation is forth
comming.
That is why the Internet changes things.
> > We want to bank, we want to order hamburgers on the
> > Interstate Hwy so I don't wait for my order! I want to use my PDA to
> adjust
> > my lights in my hotel (cause I don't know where the switches are, but I
> have
> > my PDA), I want to listen to my MP3 files on the rental car's stereo,
from
> > the station I programmed on the Internet.
>
> Speak of your desires and do not attribute them to others. Still I ask,
> what does that have to do with software installation procedures?
We are at the breaking edge when it comes to delivering and deploying these
technologies. System upgrades? Replacing a busted server? Reconfiguring to
use the next release of a database? These are all very, very difficult when
they must be done manually, system by system.
What is to be done if even reasonably simple applications that you happen to
desire (but I would never dare imply intersect my own) happen to require
code to be installed on your computing device? Even if we "trust" each
other, my code might not be compatible with other code you are using. This
problem may even be a known one, along with the configuration fix needed.
How do we upgrade and manage distributed applications when they do break out
of the servers and onto the Internet in peer to peer configurations?
>
> By the way, do you know what it means to program a station? I don't think
> you do, or else you would not have used, "the station I programmed on the
> Internet", since it does not belong in this discussion.
www.Sonicnet.com I am not sure why I referenced it, but I just "programmed"
my station, which delivers western music, classical, and pop. You really
haven't lived until your radio station follows Bach with Johnny Cash! No
way anyone could have followed that reference, so I am sorry for any
heartburn it caused.
>
> > We can't do all of this by coping all our files onto our bin directory.
>
> I never mentioned anythng about copying anything into bin. I never even
> mentioned bin. Further, I would never suggest putting ALL our files into
> bin let alone onto bin. The installation method has nothing to do with
what
> the software can do once it is installed.
Forget the reference to bin (a really dirt simple install method that likely
predates you a bit).
However, you nailed it on the head there! Let me repeat you:
> The installation method has nothing to do with what
> the software can do once it is installed.
So true. And my point. And it doesn't matter who did it either. And
installs are solely modifications to storage. Just changes to some data
structures (the file system). So rather than argue those points (which it
seems we now agree on them) explain why we should describe these
modifications differently for different target systems? Why the information
about how these structures are interrelated is uninteresting past install?
Why versioning of applications (and their related structural changes)
doesn't have to be explict? And why should we do installs from within the
OS? Why not outside the OS where we can manage everything, across
platforms, in the same way?
> You are begining to sound like a person how has come up with a half baked
> idea to solve a problem that does not exist and is now trying to convince
> others that they have a problem so that your can sell them your solution
for
> it. Yes sir you have trouble right here in River City!
Well, we do. You might be managing a single system, but I am not. And I am
in the position of having to explain to customers how they are going to
manage their systems after I have gone to my next job. Or explain to them
that we have spent three weeks getting an application to work, but we don't
have anything to check in to the source code control system. ("We were not
working on code. It took us three weeks to get X to talk to Y, and for Z to
come up configured to point to A through firewall B. We are documenting it,
so if something goes wrong, you will be able <cough, look at toes> to
duplicate what we had to do to make it work. We will check that docuement
in. >")
------------------------------
From: "paul snow" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.text.xml,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux, XML, and assalting Windows
Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 05:34:22 GMT
Some of these things have to be configured together. And I need them on
platforms other than NeXT and Mac. And I need to gather all the decision
points made during installs, and perhaps coordiante them with other installs
on different machines.
Sure, it isn't clear from the list I gave you. But I could have listed
Websphere advanced, with an Oracle adaptor, MQSeries client and server, DB2
server and client, along with DB2 Everywhere for our handhelds, Version X of
the C++ compiler, the proper JDK, DCE server, and DCE clients, etc. across
four NT Boxes, the firewalls (with the proper ports punched, and the ORB
configured to use them).
Simple installs (Such as NeXT-style bundles) would be a huge improvement
over what I generally have to deal with. Still, it wouldn't resolve the
bigger picture.
Today there is a big push to establish large abstractions that simply make
computing a homogenous place. I don't think that is really the answer.
Abstractions only do their work if they are properly deployed.
Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> "paul snow" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> [snip about ditching "package managers" all together]
>
> > Ah those simple days of yore! But we can't and we won't go back.
> >
> > Today we have Java VMs and Adobe Acrobat viewers, and browsers, and
browser
> > plug-ins, word processing packages, and stock tickers, Internet based
games,
> > etc. Never mind that we are going to be configuring systems to connect
with
> > other systems, and use databases, and database clients, and we need to
set
> > up security, and down load the new versions of our clients, etc.
>
> ... enter NeXT-style bundles. They can handle all the above, and you
> only need to know how to use cp(1) to install them.
>
> > It isn't going to be simple in the future. It is going to get worse.
In
> > another post I list a set of requirements we are going to need from a
> > package manager. Not want, need. Typewriters are out for good. And
> > Redmond may be at fault to some degree, but if so they only pushed us
ahead
> > in time a bit. It was going to happen to us anyway.
> >
> > We have to have package managers, but they need to be based on open
> > standards. And they need to operate in an environment outside the
execution
> > environment of the supported computer systems. They need to be able to
> > manage cross platform, distributed applications. Why? Because we are
on
> > the Internet already! We want to bank, we want to order hamburgers on
the
> > Interstate Hwy so I don't wait for my order! I want to use my PDA to
adjust
> > my lights in my hotel (cause I don't know where the switches are, but I
have
> > my PDA), I want to listen to my MP3 files on the rental car's stereo,
from
> > the station I programmed on the Internet.
> >
> > We can't do all of this by coping all our files onto our bin directory.
> > Sorry.
>
> Why not? Isn't the operating system supposed to do the mundane
> things for us anyway?
> --
> The wheel is turning but the hamster is dead.
> Craig Kelley -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.isu.edu/~kellcrai finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] for PGP block
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bill Unruh)
Subject: Re: Check out this weird linux behavior
Date: 28 Aug 2000 05:35:31 GMT
Well, I would suspect a hack.
What in the world is in.amqd?in.sysched? What are all those identd's
doing there? You seem to have a lot of daemons running-- do you really
need them?
If you are on an rpm system, do
rpm -Va|grep '^..5'>/tmp/verify
and look for crucial files which have been altered.
Then, when you are sure you have a good find, do
find / -perms +4000 -ls
and figure out whether each of those suid files is legitimate.
Who is charles running irc (without being logged in)?
In <MPG.14135fd2a9c7b56f989688@news> Rudy Moore <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
]My machine is doing weird things :). For one, the hosts.deny file is
]now empty, and I can't make changes to it! vi now allowing me to write
]to it, prompted me to do a chmod 777, which I wasn't allowed to do!
]Anyone know why this is happening? (hack?)
][chris@dr-evil chris]$ su -l
]Password:
][root@dr-evil /root]# ls -al /etc/hosts.deny
]-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1 Jul 13 01:35 /etc/hosts.deny
][root@dr-evil /root]# chmod 777 /etc/hosts.deny
]chmod: /etc/hosts.deny: Operation not permitted
][root@dr-evil /root]# rm /etc/hosts.deny
]rm: remove write-protected file `/etc/hosts.deny'? y
]rm: cannot unlink `/etc/hosts.deny': Operation not permitted
][root@dr-evil /root]# whoami
]root
]=======================
]here's a ps:
][root@dr-evil /etc]# ps -auxc
]USER PID %CPU %MEM SIZE RSS TTY STAT START TIME COMMAND
]bin 340 0.0 0.6 1212 420 ? S 08:11 0:00 portmap
]chris 5338 0.1 1.7 1832 1088 2 S 01:10 0:00 irc
]daemon 470 0.0 0.4 1144 296 ? S 08:11 0:00 atd
]nobody 452 0.0 0.8 1300 532 ? S 08:11 0:00 identd
]nobody 453 0.0 0.8 1300 532 ? S 08:11 0:00 identd
]nobody 454 0.0 0.8 1300 532 ? S 08:11 0:00 identd
]nobody 458 0.0 0.8 1300 532 ? S 08:11 0:00 identd
]nobody 459 0.0 0.8 1300 532 ? S 08:11 0:00 identd
]nobody 4725 0.0 3.1 7336 1980 ? S 22:55 0:00 httpd
]nobody 4726 0.0 4.1 7324 2636 ? S 22:55 0:00 httpd
]nobody 4727 0.0 7.1 7324 4532 ? S 22:55 0:00 httpd
]nobody 4728 0.0 7.0 7288 4452 ? S 22:55 0:00 httpd
]nobody 4729 0.0 7.2 7336 4540 ? S 22:55 0:00 httpd
]nobody 4730 0.0 7.1 7324 4532 ? S 22:55 0:00 httpd
]nobody 4731 0.0 7.2 7336 4536 ? S 22:55 0:00 httpd
]nobody 4732 0.0 7.2 7336 4536 ? S 22:55 0:00 httpd
]root 1 0.0 0.7 1120 476 ? S 08:10 0:04 init
]root 3 0.0 0.0 0 0 ? SW 08:10 0:00 kupdate
]root 4 0.0 0.0 0 0 ? SW 08:10 0:00 kpiod
]root 5 0.0 0.0 0 0 ? SW 08:10 0:00 kswapd
]root 6 0.0 0.0 0 0 ? SW< 08:10 0:00 mdrecoveryd
]root 149 0.0 0.7 1588 456 ? S 08:10 0:00 in.amdq
]root 151 0.0 0.7 1224 460 ? S 08:10 0:00 in.sysched
]root 355 0.0 0.0 0 0 ? SW 08:11 0:00 lockd
]root 379 0.0 0.6 1104 388 ? S 08:11 0:00 apmd
]root 430 0.0 0.2 296 188 ? S 08:11 0:00 syslogd
]root 439 0.0 1.0 1440 676 ? S 08:11 0:00 klogd
]root 484 0.0 0.8 1328 564 ? S 08:11 0:00 crond
]root 534 0.0 0.7 1204 484 ? S 08:11 0:00 lpd
]root 626 0.0 0.7 1300 444 ? S 08:11 0:00 dhcpd
]root 652 0.0 0.6 1092 408 3 S 08:11 0:00 mingetty
]root 653 0.0 0.6 1092 408 4 S 08:11 0:00 mingetty
]root 654 0.0 0.6 1092 408 5 S 08:11 0:00 mingetty
]root 655 0.0 0.6 1092 408 6 S 08:11 0:00 mingetty
]root 4722 0.0 5.9 7204 3724 ? S 22:55 0:01 httpd
]root 5130 0.0 1.3 2152 880 1 S 00:50 0:00 su
]root 5164 0.0 2.8 2644 1784 ? S 00:52 0:00 named
]root 5267 0.0 1.4 1884 916 ? S 01:05 0:00 in.ftpd
]root 5391 0.0 1.5 2156 952 ? S 01:17 0:00 su
]root 5420 0.0 0.6 932 412 ? R 01:19 0:00 ps
]xfs 614 0.0 1.0 1716 676 ? S 08:11 0:00 xfs
------------------------------
From: "Sly" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: From RedHat to SuSE: A simple question
Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 01:46:34 -0400
Totally subjective, absolutely non-scientific. It's my personal experience.
RH is extremely slow on my P133 with 80 Mb of RAM. It alweays been. You
click on a button to have the list of icons and you can drink a coffe before
the complete list appears. RedHat is the champ of segmentation faults, which
is certainly as annoying as the Blue Screen of Death. Again, my personal
experience of the distro. That is my definition of "stability". Not
stability of the linux kernel, but the overall stability of a distro. Gnome
is known to run like sh*t under RH. When a lot of program crash under a
certain distro, I don't consider it stable.
Mandrake is faster, yet you better be patient on an old pentium. The more
eye candy they provide (quite a lot in 7.1) the more demanding. Way to much
for an older computer. And I had new problems with every new Mandrake dsitro
(impossible to configure network with 7.0 - with two different installation
CDs! - and keymap problems even Mandrake support couldn't solve with 7.1).
Of course, the various speeds don't show that much on my Pentium III 500 Mhz
w/128 Mb of RAM. But my server is on the older one, so I need a distro that
concentrate on efficiency, not goodies. SuSE does that.
And some tools are better than others: if you don't use pop server, fine.
But if you do, Suse's makes rings around the imap package of RH and
Mandrake. And as far as printing is concerned, APSfilter is far better than
printtool. Again, from my personal experience and IMO.
It's just a metter of personal choice.
"Monte Milanuk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> a �crit dans le message news:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Ok, I feel I have to comment on this one! ;) I made the RedHat -->
> SuSE transistion right about the time SuSE 6.0 came out, primarily for
> a) sound support ala OSS, and KDE. I have purchased every version since
> (6.1,2,3,4), and have largely been satisfied w/ the overall
> performance. I have tinkered w/ the various Mandrake and RedHat
> versions in the same time period, as well as a little meddling w/
> Slackware (I started on it around v.3.0, years ago), Debian, Corel, and
> TurboLinux. By far the most I have messed w/ a non-SuSE distro recently
> would be Mandrake. And I would have to say that w/ the exception of
> Mandrake, there wasn't a noticeable performance difference btwn _any_ of
> the ones I tried. And again, w/ the exception of Mandrake, I never
> noticed a significant difference in stability. Granted, Mandrake is
> somewhat more bleeding edge, especially w/ their last few versions being
> a marked departure from their original 'follow-the-leader(redhat)'
> stance.
>
> I'd be interested in what you base these claims that SuSE is 'by far the
> most stable RPM-based distro out there...' and especially how you
> decided that it is 'quite a lot faster than RH & Mandrake...' since
> Mandrake is Pentium-optimized, and SuSE (just like RedHat) is
> i386-optimized, plus any custom/expert install of Mandrake offers the
> option of turning on hard drive optimization, which granted, is easily
> done on just about any linux distro. On my box, that boosts the test
> speed from 3.8Mb/s to 19.7Mb/s. So how in the heck is SuSE any faster?
>
> Please keep in mind that I am not trying to bash SuSE here, I am just
> trying to present a reality check. I recently switched over from SuSE
> 6.4 to RedHat 6.2 GPL, at least for a while, w/ a copy of KRUD on the
> way. When 7.0 comes out, I'll probably wait and get a GPL copy of it,
> test it out, and maybe I'll go back, maybe I won't. SuSE's mailing list
> support is bar none the best I've seen yet. I'm just getting tired of
> every time a new kernel comes out, anyone who uses OSS for their sound
> is hosed -- either upgrade and have no sound, or pay for a new version
> of OSS on your own. Not completely SuSE's fault, but one of a few
> annoyances. Probably a large part of why SuSE has heavily funded parts
> of Alsa, and use it in 7.0.
>
> Oh, and by the way, as far as transistion from RedHat to SuSE, the
> runlevels are different, as well. I believe, in RedHat, runlevel 2 is
> multi-user non-networked, runlevel 3 is multi-user networked, and
> runlevel 5 is multi-user networked w/ X. In SuSE, runlevel 2 is
> multi-user networked, and runlevel 3 is multi-user networked w/ X
>
>
>
> Jerry L Kreps wrote:
> >
> > Sylvain Demers wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > I've just decided to drop RedHat for SuSE. I am extremely impressed
with
> > > the robustness of SuSE. It is by far the most stable RPM-based disto
out
> > > there, and quite a lot faster than RH & Mandrake in many regards. My
> > > only problem now is to figure out where is what (I've been using RH
and
> > > Mandrake almost exculively for the last year and a half or so), since
> > > SuSE is quite different than RH as far as configuration files goes.
> > >
> > > Can someone tell me what is the equivalent (if any) of the
/etc/rc.local
> > > file under SuSE? I used to add some commands in rc.local under Redhat,
> > > but I can't find where to put them under SuSE. I'm seriously
considering
> > > buying the new 7.0 box set, since a book would really come handy. I'm
> > > currently using the eval copy I got from the Net.
> > >
> > > Thanks in advance
> > >
> > > Sylvain
> >
> > Welcome to SuSE! I made the same journey you are on during the fall of
> > 1998. I have never been disappointed with a SuSE distro. When 7.0
> > comes out I plan to go the PRO route.
> >
> > In general, you should read chapter 17 of the SuSE manual. You can
> > download a PostScript of an English version from the SuSE webstite if
> > you don't have a paper copy. It will detail the SuSE boot sequence and
> > the order in which files are consulted or run.
> >
> > ~/.bashrc is where you put your local env and var settings (The file
> > '.profile' is in your
> > home dir but it is used by SuSE and you are admonished to put your
> > settings in .bashrc)
> > jerry@JLKreps:~ > locate bashrc
> > /etc/skel/.bashrc
> > /home/jerry/.bashrc
> > /home/june/.bashrc
> >
> > If you are going to install special device drivers, set cron stuff,
> > etc., then boot.local is the file.
> > jerry@JLKreps:~ > locate boot.local
> > /sbin/init.d/boot.local
> >
> > I find that YaST and KPackage (KDE) as root are my two most important
> > install programs. I do the occasional tar and manual setting stuff,
> > when I have to, but I prefer the two above.
> >
> > What YaST does is put your entries into a file called /etc/rc.config.
> > Then, when you exit YaST, /sbin/SuSEconfig is fired and it reads
> > rc.config and calls a variety of perl scripts to do the actual work,
> > feeding to them the parameters taken from rc.config. If you change
> > rc.config manually then you should envoke /sbin/SuSEconfig manually to
> > make sure your changes take place. This allows you to change your
> > system without having to reboot it. Chapter 17 decribes the vars in
> > rc.config.
> >
> > You will be in for a pleasent ride with SuSE. I leave my machine on,
> > connected to the internet 24/7 for weeks at a time, shuting it down only
> > when lightening is outside. The last hang I had was in the fall of
> > 1998, when I was writing some C++ code and I inadvertantly looped the
> > mouse and keyboard, necessitating a power cycle. (I couldn't telnet in
> > because I am not on a network.) Apps do crash, however, and it is good
> > to know the key strokes on page 419.
> >
> > Have fun!
> > Jerry
------------------------------
From: "Sly" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: From RedHat to SuSE: A simple question
Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 01:47:54 -0400
Thanks a lot for all the info Jerry, that sure will help. And I can't wait
to get the PRO 7.0 too!
"Jerry L Kreps" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> a �crit dans le message news:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sylvain Demers wrote:
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I've just decided to drop RedHat for SuSE. I am extremely impressed with
> > the robustness of SuSE. It is by far the most stable RPM-based disto out
> > there, and quite a lot faster than RH & Mandrake in many regards. My
> > only problem now is to figure out where is what (I've been using RH and
> > Mandrake almost exculively for the last year and a half or so), since
> > SuSE is quite different than RH as far as configuration files goes.
> >
> > Can someone tell me what is the equivalent (if any) of the /etc/rc.local
> > file under SuSE? I used to add some commands in rc.local under Redhat,
> > but I can't find where to put them under SuSE. I'm seriously considering
> > buying the new 7.0 box set, since a book would really come handy. I'm
> > currently using the eval copy I got from the Net.
> >
> > Thanks in advance
> >
> > Sylvain
>
> Welcome to SuSE! I made the same journey you are on during the fall of
> 1998. I have never been disappointed with a SuSE distro. When 7.0
> comes out I plan to go the PRO route.
>
> In general, you should read chapter 17 of the SuSE manual. You can
> download a PostScript of an English version from the SuSE webstite if
> you don't have a paper copy. It will detail the SuSE boot sequence and
> the order in which files are consulted or run.
>
> ~/.bashrc is where you put your local env and var settings (The file
> '.profile' is in your
> home dir but it is used by SuSE and you are admonished to put your
> settings in .bashrc)
> jerry@JLKreps:~ > locate bashrc
> /etc/skel/.bashrc
> /home/jerry/.bashrc
> /home/june/.bashrc
>
> If you are going to install special device drivers, set cron stuff,
> etc., then boot.local is the file.
> jerry@JLKreps:~ > locate boot.local
> /sbin/init.d/boot.local
>
> I find that YaST and KPackage (KDE) as root are my two most important
> install programs. I do the occasional tar and manual setting stuff,
> when I have to, but I prefer the two above.
>
> What YaST does is put your entries into a file called /etc/rc.config.
> Then, when you exit YaST, /sbin/SuSEconfig is fired and it reads
> rc.config and calls a variety of perl scripts to do the actual work,
> feeding to them the parameters taken from rc.config. If you change
> rc.config manually then you should envoke /sbin/SuSEconfig manually to
> make sure your changes take place. This allows you to change your
> system without having to reboot it. Chapter 17 decribes the vars in
> rc.config.
>
> You will be in for a pleasent ride with SuSE. I leave my machine on,
> connected to the internet 24/7 for weeks at a time, shuting it down only
> when lightening is outside. The last hang I had was in the fall of
> 1998, when I was writing some C++ code and I inadvertantly looped the
> mouse and keyboard, necessitating a power cycle. (I couldn't telnet in
> because I am not on a network.) Apps do crash, however, and it is good
> to know the key strokes on page 419.
>
> Have fun!
> Jerry
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Richard Steiner)
Subject: Re: Advice sought, (new user coming from OS/2)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 00:25:49 -0500
Here in comp.os.linux.misc, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rod Smith)
spake unto us, saying:
[Regarding HPFS support in the 2.4.x kernels]
>HPFS read/write support includes the ability to store Linux ownership
>and permissions in HPFS EAs, so it's a better choice for this task
>than would be FAT.
Wow -- I wasn't aware of that. Very nice. Maybe HPFS would be a more
appropriate filesystem for data use than I first thought...
--
-Rich Steiner >>>---> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>---> Bloomington, MN
OS/2 + BeOS + Linux + Solaris + Win95 + WinNT4 + FreeBSD + DOS
+ VMWare + Fusion + vMac + Executor = PC Hobbyist Heaven! :-)
OPCODE: HCF = Halt and Catch Fire
------------------------------
From: "paul snow" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.os.linux,comp.text.xml,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux, XML, and assalting Windows
Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 05:50:27 GMT
> You do realize that is software that gives any meaning to the data on the
> storage device beyond just a collection of bytes or bits arranged as fixed
> sized records in th case of DASD devices. It is the processor that gives
> any meaning to the contents of ROMs, without interpretation the data is
just
> a random collection of whatever method is used to record the data. Just
> like writing is just a random collection of marking for someone who can
not
> read it.
>
> What do you mean by "other platforms"? It seems that you are not using
the
> same meaning that is attached to it by the reset of us.
My point is that the storage defines the software. Meaning is another
issue, related closely to Magic.
The storage exists logically outside the execution environment of the
software. Storage can be constructed for a processor with the software we
want that processor to use.
platform -- a physically different computer or a different OS or a different
processor, or smart storage. I'm pretty flexible with how you understand
the term platform. Most readings work, best I can tell. I'll even take a
virtual machine or two.
BTW, Does it hurt to be reset ? ;-)
------------------------------
** FOR YOUR REFERENCE **
The service address, to which questions about the list itself and requests
to be added to or deleted from it should be directed, is:
Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
You can send mail to the entire list (and comp.os.linux.misc) via:
Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Linux may be obtained via one of these FTP sites:
ftp.funet.fi pub/Linux
tsx-11.mit.edu pub/linux
sunsite.unc.edu pub/Linux
End of Linux-Misc Digest
******************************
