Can we just let this drop? I've been so delighted to have the list back and now this flame war has gone on a little too long. Ahmet, several people explained the George Orwell reference almost immediately, yet instead of accepting the explanation and moving on, you feel the need to perpetuate imagined slights based on your misconception. So you didn't read Animal Farm. Fine. But you know now, because several people told you, that Ben was not calling police "pigs." Could you please just drop this line of posting? Because you're still clinging to a faulty assumption.
Thanks for considering it. And to get back to liveaboard topics, we're considering selling the monohull and buying a cat. Hands up, who's got one, what do you have and how do you like it? Marce Still in Pittsburgh From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of ahmet erkan Sent: Tuesday, July 06, 2010 11:02 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [Liveaboard] How many international sailors with HF get a restricted radio permit. "Name like "Ahmet"... *and* in NYC, violating the law... obviously a damn terrorist. Hmm, let's see: should I slam you down on the ground, cuff you, and take you in - maybe breaking a few bones in the process and adding a "resisting arrest" charge to justify it - or should I just shoot you and claim that your muffler sounded like gunshots?" Ben, The police officer (if he had an exceptionally ugly personality) might "slam me down, cuff me and break a few bones because of my name but not because of my attitude. No matter how ugly the cops personality may be I do not think he will shoot me because of my name. Unless of course If I were rambling on and on in a "educated but unintelligently hostile" attitude similar to yours, plus the noisy muffler, plus with the undesirable name Ahmet. Then I may become "Achmet the dead terrorist". (Not from George Orwell but Jeff Dunham.) BTW thank you for the lesson about George Orwell, I will research it when I find the time and understand what is meant by "some pigs being more equal than others". I still do not know and I do not care enough to go and read the book right now. If I quoted a phrase from a well known or a not so well known author, I would a add a sentence to explain the relevance, rather than arrogantly boast my superior education. Folks, I am posting this reply not to continue the P... race with our charming Mr. Okopnik but to steer the subject back to an area very important for boaters. How to deal with persons that have bad attitudes or inferiority complexes if these people have uniforms and guns and the law is on their side when they come to board our boats and search our belongings, ask for paperwork regarding issues that they really don't care about, and count the lifejackets when they could care less if we drowned or not. (Never sure if it is could or couldn't care less) As usual Norm has the most practical answer. "Make their job easy for them". What I might add is, at the start "Declare that the US coast guard boarding party has the Captain's permission to come on board and the Coast Guard is always welcome aboard your vessel" Have the registration readily available all paid and current. Carry a DL or another picture ID but also a passport, passports last for 10 years and not that expensive to renew. Have fresh flares, right kind of fire extinguisher, and life jackets for everybody on board. Operational running lights, fog horn, whatever they look for have it ready. Hand them the list. What do you do when they check and something fails? Fess up and say, something to the effect "I have just become aware of this issue and I will resolve it as soon as possible" and say it in the most professional way you can muster. My Navy training comes very handy here. Like in Ron's example what if the cop is not the stiff upper lip type and makes an off color joke like "you are lucky my wife was good to me last night that is why you are not getting a ticket". Have a sense of humor, even if the joke is sexist or unprofessional or whatever it is sort of funny. Smile a little and tell him to make sure he lets his wife know how grateful you are. Remember, you are not groveling or kissing up, you are aware that he is playing a game with you because he knows you are not the bad guy but he can inconvenience you if he wanted to due to the minor infraction and you are acknowledging his power but you are not afraid of him because you are glad he is there to enforce the laws. etc etc. I would like to hear more people talk about their first hand experiences with unreasonable cops or coast guard officers and how they handled or mishandled a certain situation, and what would they do if the same thing happened again. Fair Winds Ahmet > From: [email protected] > Date: Sun, 4 Jul 2010 22:56:55 -0400 > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Liveaboard] How many international sailors with HF get a restricted radio permit. > > On Sun, Jul 04, 2010 at 06:13:39PM -0400, ahmet erkan wrote: > > > > Dear Ben, > > If I were the NYC police officer, and stopped you for your broken muffler you > > would have probably received a ticket and probably more because of the > > infraction augmented by the attitude. Ron on the other hand may just get a > > verbal warning. It is a human thing. Let me know if you can't figure it out? > > Ah, here we go off to fantasy land. Guess what I'd do to you if _I_ was > an NY PO stopping you for a broken muffler - and I had *your* attitude? > > Name like "Ahmet"... *and* in NYC, violating the law... obviously a damn > terrorist. Hmm, let's see: should I slam you down on the ground, cuff > you, and take you in - maybe breaking a few bones in the process and > adding a "resisting arrest" charge to justify it - or should I just > shoot you and claim that your muffler sounded like gunshots? > > ... > > Better yet, let's avoid the "if I were" fantasies. Most people stop > playing at those after kindergarten or so, because that kind of > thinly-disguised hostility isn't likely to be well received. In fact, > even in kindergarten, it's likely to be met with a real - as opposed to > a verbal - punch in the nose. Let me know if you can't figure out the > social dynamic here; I'll draw you a diagram. > > > Better yet ask Ron. Don't ask Norm!... Having said that, Norm probably wouldnt > > say anything deragotary to the "police officer" during the event but may refer > > to him as a "pig" just like you or give him some other disrespectful title > > after the event. > > Just like me? Wow. You get an 'F' for reading comprehension, and another > 'F' for ignorance. Nowhere in that email did I refer to a policeman as a > pig - that was a reference to George Orwell's "Animal Farm", in which > some pigs were indeed "more equal" than others. > > Perhaps you should consider asking someone to interpret for you before > you go haring off to the keyboard to type out intemperate and > misinformed responses? Just a thought. > > > -- > OKOPNIK CONSULTING > Custom Computing Solutions For Your Business > Expert-led Training | Dynamic, vital websites | Custom programming > 443-250-7895 http://okopnik.com > _______________________________________________ > Liveaboard mailing list > [email protected] > To adjust your membership settings over the web http://liveaboardonline.com/mailman/listinfo/liveaboard > To subscribe send an email to [email protected] > > To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected] > The archives are at http://www.liveaboardonline.com/pipermail/liveaboard/ > > To search the archives http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] > > The Mailman Users Guide can be found here http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman/mailman-member/index.html _____ The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. Get started. <http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID28326::T:WLMTAGL:ON: WL:en-US:WM_HMP:042010_3>
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