Actually you called it illegal downloading not me. I just used your wording in reply to your email. I think people are confusing themselves on this thread now, because there are so many emails :-)
" Would kyle not just be bending the definition just like the IP lawyers are bending the damage caused by illegal downloading to say, 50.000USD per song?" On 10/08/2010, Reinier Battenberg <[email protected]> wrote: > > it is technically not even illegal downloading. It is providing access to a > recording of copyrighted material. > > but we are debating wether it is theft or not. > > as people are pointing out, there is theft, and there is copyright > infringement. Your statement is that it is the same, others are argueing (up > to the US Supreme Court, which seems to agree), that it is not the exact same > thing. > > > -- > > rgds, > > Reinier Battenberg > Director > Mountbatten Ltd. > +256 758 801 749 > www.mountbatten.net > > > > > On Tuesday 10 August 2010 12:45:55 Tim Schofield wrote: > > But as you say Renier it is _illegal_ downloading. Just because the > > lawyers may be crooked doesn't it still mean that the download is > > legal? > > > > On 10/08/2010, Reinier Battenberg <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > Would kyle not just be bending the definition just like the IP lawyers > > > are bending the damage caused by illegal downloading to say, 50.000USD > > > per song? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > rgds, > > > > > > Reinier Battenberg > > > Director > > > Mountbatten Ltd. > > > +256 758 801 749 > > > www.mountbatten.net > > > > > > On Tuesday 10 August 2010 11:32:20 Tim Schofield wrote: > > > > Well Kyle you have a unique definition of theft that I have never come > > > > across before in my 50 years on this planet. > > > > > > > > If I hack into amazons servers and download the credit card details of > > > > all their customers, the law would say I have stolen that data. I dont > > > > have to remove them, I still have stolen them and I would be charged > > > > with the theft of that data. If you break into someones offices and > > > > take copies of their private information from their filing cabinets, > > > > that is theft. > > > > > > > > it is not archiving, cloning, or any other of the words that have been > > > > used here, it is theft. > > > > > > > > You are the only person on this list arguing that taking something > > > > that does not belong to you without the permission of the owner is not > > > > theft. The argument of the rest of this list is that it is acceptable > > > > practice as they are being robbed by other people as well. > > > > > > > > On 10/08/2010, Kyle Spencer <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > Hey Tim, > > > > > > > > > > While I respect your position, I refuse to allow us, as a group, to > > > > > collectively base this discussion on false analogies and appeals to > > > > > emotion. > > > > > > > > > > The distinction between "theft" and "unauthorized duplication" is > > > > > /very/ important. > > > > > > > > > > The YR service is /not/ like stealing a car. If you steal my car I > > > > > no longer have it. > > > > > > > > > > On the other hand, if you walk up to my car and magically make 100 > > > > > copies of it, I still have my car and it has /not/ been stolen. > > > > > > > > > > I am not arguing whether either one is right, wrong, or has more or > > > > > less impact than the other. I only argue that the outcomes of > > > > > these two actions are very different and should not morally or > > > > > legally be judged as the same. > > > > > > > > > > Personally, I think the real interesting questions regarding IP law > > > > > are: > > > > > > > > > > If we all have the ability to clone things for free, why should we > > > > > pay for those things? > > > > > > > > > > Is it safe to build economies on markets of artificial scarcity? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Kyle Spencer > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original message ----- > > > > > > > > > > > Ok, there are lots of threads within a thread here so let me > > > > > > summarise > > > > > > > > > > > > the arguments. Please feel free to comment if you do not agree. > > > > > > > > > > > > It is a fact that Badru has a site on which he is distributing > > > > > > copyrighted material that does not belong to him and without the > > > > > > permission of the owners. > > > > > > > > > > > > It is a fact that taking something that does not belong to you > > > > > > without the permission of the owner is theft. > > > > > > > > > > > > Badru and others say that this is acceptable as there are other > > > > > > people who are also stealing from these people so he may as well > > > > > > join in. I do not agree with this. > > > > > > > > > > > > This is a Linux user group. Linux would not exist without > > > > > > copyright law. If people in the rest of the world do not respect > > > > > > copyright law, the software we all enjoy will disappear. > > > > > > > > > > > > It is not ok to portray this as the developing world against the > > > > > > developed world. Other developing countries including the rest of > > > > > > EAC are trying to respect the rights of copyright holders. Why > > > > > > can't Uganda. > > > > > > > > > > > > These are hard working creative artists and programmers that you > > > > > > are agreeing it is acceptable to steal from. > > > > > > > > > > > > This summarisesz my position I think. > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > WebERP Africa Ltd > > > > > > +447710427049 > > > > > > +256752963327 > > > > > > +255784602561 > > > > > > www.weberpafrica.com > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > > > > LUG mailing list > > > > > > [email protected] > > > > > > http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > > > > > > > > > > > > LUG is generously hosted by INFOCOM http://www.infocom.co.ug/ > > > > > > > > > > > > All Archives can be found at > > > > > > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > > > > > > > > > > > > The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them > > > > > > (including attachments if any). The List's Host is not > > > > > > responsible for them in any way. > > > > > > --------------------------------------- > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > LUG mailing list > > > [email protected] > > > http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > > > > > > LUG is generously hosted by INFOCOM http://www.infocom.co.ug/ > > > > > > All Archives can be found at > > > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > > > > > > The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including > > > attachments if any). The List's Host is not responsible for them in any > > > way. --------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > LUG mailing list > [email protected] > http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug > > LUG is generously hosted by INFOCOM http://www.infocom.co.ug/ > > All Archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > > The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including > attachments if any). The List's Host is not responsible for them in any way. > --------------------------------------- > > -- WebERP Africa Ltd +447710427049 +256752963327 +255784602561 www.weberpafrica.com _______________________________________________ LUG mailing list [email protected] http://kym.net/mailman/listinfo/lug LUG is generously hosted by INFOCOM http://www.infocom.co.ug/ All Archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ The above comments and data are owned by whoever posted them (including attachments if any). The List's Host is not responsible for them in any way. ---------------------------------------
