So at least some 16th century lute music is perhaps partially sketched- and I thought that basso continuo was the original, 1/2 baked, finish-at-home-in-your-oven pizza! Nope, no instructions in the lute solo pizza boxes that have come down to us. Some like anchovies & eggplant, others find such ornamentation disgusting. Parallel olives and clams to be avoided. Crusty cadences, no missing ingredients!

Incidentally, I have been wondering about a lot of Weiss' music- (which I have been playing obsessively for the past few years)- seems to want chords filled in, in a number of places. Or is it just my preference to make some spots sound fuller, lusher? No missing lines, of course; fully composed music by one of the immortals- in his own hand mostly- but certain cadential spots, here and there.

Which Lumsden editions are you referring to?



On 11/13/2012 2:29 PM, David Tayler wrote:
     Of course the original sources are fine, I sort of have a question
    about whether they are like those half-baked loaves of bread in the
    store that you heat up at home--whether some of the details were left
    out so you could provide them at the time of playing, or whether there
    were, as I suspect, conventions or rules for filling in the details
    that people knew and did not have to write down. Otherwise it is sort
    of a "raw toast" scenario.
    When Lumsden made his editions, he basically "corrected" some of the
    pieces, sometimes in a very clever way, but sometimes so that they lost
    their character. And for me that is what I would like to avoid, so I go
    for versions that have their own character.
    dt
    --- On Tue, 11/13/12, Dan Winheld <[email protected]> wrote:

      From: Dan Winheld <[email protected]>
      Subject: Re: [LUTE] Reconstructing Dowland; deconstructing Dowland
      To: "David Tayler" <[email protected]>
      Cc: "lute" <[email protected]>
      Date: Tuesday, November 13, 2012, 2:22 PM

    Thank you Professor Tayler!
    Excellent points, exquisite playing, and -from what I can hear on my
    wretched computer- a correct & satisfying tenor line. That would have
    been a bit slow tempo for me some years ago, but as I age it's becoming
    pleasant to take more time with things. And enjoy the work of others
    who do.
    In my own career as a lazy consumer of lute food, I just plays 'em as I
    finds 'em. If one version doesn't smell right for one reason or
    another, I search until I find one that does. And a few times, I have
    also bit the bullet and corrected inner voices- to the best of my
    relatively limited, less-educated ability. Many, many of the solos
    exist as lute songs- and of course the "Lachrimae, or Seaven Teares..."
    consort edition- and these sources can provide some guidance for
    improving the helter-skelter lute solos. And mentally slapping my own
    wrist as I try to monitor my impulse to dribble out some crass
    ornamentation at times. (Tourette's Syndrome on the lute can get ugly
    if not kept in check.)
    One of these days you should do another local luter's workshop- this
    time on the Dowland solos, (and maybe a couple of Danyel, Rossiter, &
    Holborne tunes as well). I'll supply the single malt, maybe even the
    premises, if that helps...
    Dan
    On 11/13/2012 12:33 PM, David Tayler wrote:
    >      Most of Dowland's lute solos come down to use a sketch--two
    outside
    >     lines, a few chords, and some "noodly appendages"--ornaments
    added by
    >     lutebook owners or their copyists.
    >     Many conclusions can be drawn, but the basic question remains,
    what to
    >     do with all of these sources? Obviously, performing them "as is"
    is one
    >     solution, and perfectly fine--a snapshot in time of what a lute
    player
    >     of the time would have played. Absoutely OK, and there it is, in
    the
    >     ms. But suppose there is more?
    >     The other path is to add inner voices and strip out the noodly
    >     appendages. I've given this quite a bit of thought over the last
    >     twenty-five years, and I have a few simple guidelines.
    >     1. Eliminate parallel fifths and octaves. Dowland never wrote bad
    >     counterpoint, so these have to go. Famous example is the version
    of
    >     Lachrimae with the parallel fifth in the opening phrase, even
    though
    >     Dowland's published version is different.
    >     2. Strip out "orbiting" noodly appendages. One sure sign of
    cookbook,
    >     color-by-number ornaments are those that present a set of added
    melodic
    >     sequences that start and end on the same note. Accomplished
    composers
    >     rarely use these, they are intended mainly for students. By
    returning
    >     to the same note, you mostly avoid the problem of parallel
    octaves and
    >     fifths, thus, an amateur who could not read music and did not
    study
    >     counterpoint could provide "correct" counterpoint in simple
    ornaments.
    >     Ornamentation treatises mention this trick as a way to dive in to
    >     ornamentation: nothing wrong with it, but it is for
    beginners--not
    >     Dowland.
    >     3. Make sure cadences have leading tones somewhere in the bar,
    and end
    >     chords with thirds in the harmony. Although you see open fifths
    in mid
    >     century lute works, by 1590 you mainly see full harmony. A
    skilled
    >     player would not play G Major with a third and C "Major" without
    the
    >     third just to avoid fifth position, and you see this in the ms
    sources.
    >     Whether these open chords were simply sketches, or intentionally
    left
    >     to the play to fill in, foreshadowing later works such as Visee,
    these
    >     need leading tones.
    >     4. Inner parts. Dowland's works at an absolute minimum always
    support a
    >     tenor or alto part, or both. If they are missing, they need to be
    >     supplied. There are a myriad of examples in the lute solos and
    lute
    >     songs, and they follow simple rules of counterpoint. If you study
    the
    >     chromatic fantasies, you can see complex inversions and
    imitation, but
    >     ta simple, well-written line will do. After analyzing all of the
    works,
    >     I can see that they were composed with inner parts in mind--that
    is,
    >     there are no works that paint contrapuntal corners where inner
    parts
    >     are not possible, which you see in other composers.
    >     Following these rules, I have created a very simple example. In
    one
    >     place I changed the harmony to make sure the form was "rounded,"
    that
    >     is, a sort of mini refrain but the rest is pretty
    straightforward.
    >     [1]http://youtu.be/Pr7jtlXk-OU?hd=1
    >     I'm interested in new ideas going forward, before I tackle some
    of the
    >     more complex works. Please feel free to make suggestions.
    >     dt
    >
    >     --
    >
    >
    > To get on or off this list see list information at
    > [2]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
    >

    --

References

    1. http://youtu.be/Pr7jtlXk-OU?hd=1
    2. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html




Reply via email to