Hi Devin, This is exactly how the program is structured. In trees. Theres nothing new there. Nothing changes to the way you handle things. It’s just graphicsless. the actions and moving are the same.
And I don’t think it’s about because it didn’t work then, it won’t now. Different techniques are applied now, the major players, jaws, nvda and voice over are tree structures. They all take from the lower layers of the software, down to almost machine code. So the control is enormous. If in sighted mode, its a tree with mathematical or algebraic sets, it’s obviously the same with voice over except that you have a range of user interface elements like buttons etc which have particular properties. Do you need a graphic for that? No, just the boundaries of the object in space, which is taken care of by the coco framework. Anyway, this is developer stuff I should find a developer group. Cheers, Yuma Antoine Decaux "Light has no value without darkness" Mob: +612102277190 Skype: Shainobi1 twitter: http://www.twitter.com/triple7 > On 7/01/2015, at 11:21 am, Devin Prater <[email protected]> wrote: > > Well that's the main problem, that there is rarely any programming group > interested in that. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jan 6, 2015, at 7:13 PM, Sean Murphy <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > >> If people want to do an open source solution of what have been outlined >> here, go for it. I would be very interested to see if anyone would take it >> up. A lot of work. There was a screen reader on the windows which used a >> tree view like structure to navigate the GUI. It was a German product from >> memory. Don’t know if it still exists and it was removing the visual aspects >> away from the vision impaired person. A very interesting concept. >> >> The Orca people haven’t gone in this direction either. This would be one >> environment the described concept could be tested in to see if it could be >> achieved. >> >> I don’t have the programming skills to help here. >> >> >> Sean >> >> >> On 7 Jan 2015, at 12:44 am, Yuma Antoine Decaux <[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >> >>> Hi Shawn, >>> >>> Thanks for your input. >>> >>> Sometimes it's good to see where this corporate behaviour is going. Are you >>> hitting the spot completely? Am I right? Who cares? Essentially there's an >>> interest, and there is creating the environment to facilitate the idea. >>> >>> >>> Yuma Antoine Decaux >>> "Light has no value without darkness" >>> Mob: +612102277190 >>> Skype: Shainobi1 >>> twitter: http://www.twitter.com/triple7 <http://www.twitter.com/triple7> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> On 6/01/2015, at 8:10 pm, Sean Murphy <[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi all, >>>> >>>> >>>> I have to go against the grain. If you think Apple or any other vendor is >>>> going to spend time on building a non-graphical environment as outlined on >>>> this thread. It will not occur due to no market. We are .5% of the market >>>> thus there is no business requirement for them and they will not get their >>>> ROI. >>>> >>>> The CLI on the Mac does provide text base applications if you like to >>>> learn. people like things to be easy, thus why we have GUI now. >>>> >>>> Sean >>>> On 3 Jan 2015, at 5:19 am, Yuma Antoine Decaux <[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Where and when is the nFB? I heard a few conflicting ideas about the >>>>> organisation. But I would take the momentum to engage the voice. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> >>>>> Yuma Antoine Decaux >>>>> "Light has no value without darkness" >>>>> Mob: +612102277190 >>>>> Skype: Shainobi1 >>>>> twitter: http://www.twitter.com/triple7 <http://www.twitter.com/triple7> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> On 2/01/2015, at 12:59 pm, Joanne Chua <[email protected] >>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> What about if we start asking Apple to make some products that is >>>>>> specificly for voiceover, and don't worry about GPU at all hey? Won't >>>>>> it be great? Maybe, someone might want to bring this up on this year >>>>>> NFB convention? >>>>>> >>>>>> On 02/01/2015, Yuma Antoine Decaux <[email protected] >>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What I'm trying to induce here is the sense that no matter the graphic >>>>>>> outline, everything starts graphicsless and elements are pulled out of >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> lower layers, such as kernel, login daemons etc. The graphics layer >>>>>>> itself >>>>>>> cannot be omitted since it is also the core of a lot of coco frameworks >>>>>>> which voice over relies on. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> However, when I say graphcsless, I mean to place to a minimum all of the >>>>>>> animations and flash and graphics that appear. I would easily visualise >>>>>>> a UI >>>>>>> which borders, buttons and everything else are just placeholders with >>>>>>> plain >>>>>>> black and borders that don't load images. No background image, no >>>>>>> transition >>>>>>> animations, no stupid bouncing apps that go "hey I'm here" etc etc. >>>>>>> This can >>>>>>> free up ressources and reserve them for voice over itself. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Yuma Antoine Decaux >>>>>>> "Light has no value without darkness" >>>>>>> Mob: +612102277190 >>>>>>> Skype: Shainobi1 >>>>>>> twitter: http://www.twitter.com/triple7 <http://www.twitter.com/triple7> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 2/01/2015, at 10:03 am, Jason White <[email protected] >>>>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> BobH. <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> I think a lot of us have said for a good while, that modern 'puters >>>>>>>>> are >>>>>>>>> 99% >>>>>>>>> eye candy or effects; and maybe as much as 1% real work, though doubt >>>>>>>>> it. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> DOS worked so well, cos it did none of that. Boring to the sighted, >>>>>>>>> but >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> even they were more focussed on getting real info in or out and not >>>>>>>>> just >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> there to play with it. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> So, yes, a cutToTheQwik system that took us back to doing the stuff >>>>>>>>> we're >>>>>>>>> doing, without all the other overhead, would have some use; can think >>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> professional areas where it would be saleable for it's simplicity; >>>>>>>>> but >>>>>>>>> doubt it's going to happen. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It's already happening. If you work primarily from the Linux console >>>>>>>> (just >>>>>>>> using the GUI for tasks that require it, e.g., Web browsing), you >>>>>>>> essentially >>>>>>>> have what you've described. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> this can't be done in the same way under OS X, which always loads a >>>>>>>> graphical >>>>>>>> desktop environment. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I'm writing this message from a Linux virtual terminal. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> So far as the two operating systems are concerned, there are some >>>>>>>> applications >>>>>>>> for which I like to use OS X, but it's my Linux laptop that I'm using >>>>>>>> most >>>>>>>> often at home just now, even though the Macbook is newer. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups >>>>>>>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>>>>> an >>>>>>>> email to [email protected] >>>>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>>>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>>>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries >>>>>>>> <http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>. >>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups >>>>>>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>>>> an >>>>>>> email to [email protected] >>>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries >>>>>>> <http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>. >>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>>> an email to [email protected] >>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries >>>>>> <http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>. >>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>>>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>>> email to [email protected] >>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries >>>>> <http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>. >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>> email to [email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries >>>> <http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>> email to [email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries >>> <http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MacVisionaries" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]>. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]>. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries >> <http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. > > > -- > You received this message because you 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