+1 on mobile geo. I remember my little Holux M1000 GPS receiver and PPC-6850 was a pretty good combination.
I’ve always liked that solution better than the newer off the shelf products. > On Sep 17, 2016, at 8:28 AM, Kawal Gucukoglu <kgli...@icloud.com> wrote: > > But you all remember using mobile speak you couldn’t use many applications. > Mail was good and so was Skype I remember but if you wanted something that > mobile speak didn’t work with you were stuffed. The only great thing I > really liked with Mobile speak was Braille output and Mobile GEO. That was > truly brilliant, the first GP/S accessible application for a blind user to > experience. I think all of you will agree who used Mobile Speak. Now our > lives are changed for ever because of Apple’s commitment even though people > get frustrated at times as that is what it is, we don’t understand what is > changed so we will all take it out at some point. > > Kawal. >> On 16 Sep 2016, at 12:53, Donna Goodin <doniado...@me.com >> <mailto:doniado...@me.com>> wrote: >> >> Wow, there's a blast from the past! :) You're dead on, Scott. It's funny >> to think how revolutionary those MobileSpeak phones seemed at the time, and >> I would agree, it totally changed my professional and personal life. Yet >> now it kind of seems like typing on an old manual typewriter. >> >> I think there's a difference between something feeling intuitive once you >> understand it, and being intuitive to figure out. One thing I would say >> about Apple products, is that I often have the experience that once I know >> the solution to a problem it makes perfect sense, but finding the solution >> isn't always easy. Ideally, both parts of the equation should be intuitive, >> but I suppose that starts to get kind of subjective. Note that I haven't >> upgraded, so haven't tried the Mail app yet. >> Cheers, >> Donna >> >> >>> On Sep 16, 2016, at 6:42 AM, Scott Granados <sc...@qualityip.net >>> <mailto:sc...@qualityip.net>> wrote: >>> >>> You know what’s interesting, I did find the touch screen very intuitive but >>> let me qualify that. I was using touch screens before the apple products. >>> I was one of several on this list who go back to the Mobile speak days on >>> Pocket PC devices. While it seems hokey today at that time that was highly >>> life changing stuff. Having an accessible phone totally changed my >>> professional life for example being able to text with my coworkers and >>> receive alerts from automated devices and do more than here a random >>> meaningless alert with no idea what was being sent to me. >>> In comparison to mobile speak the whole apple interface seemed >>> revolutionary and oddly easy to use because you actually worked with the >>> screen instead of tapped in the different corners in combination like a >>> game. You also got visual information like screen placement and layout >>> that was never available before. So my experience probably differs from >>> yours only because I came from a really proprietary environment from code >>> factory to a more mainstream approach. Or at least different, maybe >>> mainstream isn’t the best way to express it. >>> >>> >>>> On Sep 15, 2016, at 11:25 PM, Mary Otten <motte...@gmail.com >>>> <mailto:motte...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>> >>>> What is streamline and what is intuitive? The first time you used a touch >>>> device, I daresay, you did not find it intuitive. I know I didn't. Now you >>>> and I are used to using the Mail app, for instance, in a certain way. What >>>> if it could be pointed out to you, as David did in his post, how to >>>> efficiently use the Mail app in a different way? Why is that less >>>> intuitive than what you are used to? It is change. It is not necessarily >>>> less intuitive. We're iPhone Apple is in not coming out with the >>>> documentation to let us know about this stuff when they release the final >>>> OS. Fiddling around is for beta testers. When you release a final product >>>> which is supposed to be accessible, you need to dot the eyes and cross the >>>> tease, and let us know how it is different in terms of our particular >>>> accessibility needs. That goes with the territory of universal design. I >>>> know reading is out of fashion out with specially with the younger >>>> generation. But a little bit of documentation goes a long way. >>>> A picture is not necessarily worth a few words, especially when you're >>>> dealing with someone who can't see the freaking picture. >>>> Mary >>>> >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Sep 15, 2016, at 6:03 PM, Cheree Heppe <che...@dogsc4me.com >>>> <mailto:che...@dogsc4me.com>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> It seems counterproductive to force an up-to-date, streamlined >>>>> functionality, such as iOS to emulate an older, difficult, clumsy system, >>>>> namely OS. >>>>> If I'm not mistaken, there are more users of the iOS than the OS. The >>>>> iOS represents a gateway experience that the public has readily adopted. >>>>> Among the public are large numbers of blind and disabled users. >>>>> If this new mail modality represents Apple's future for iOS, I am going >>>>> to be forced into seeking another phone and notebook alternative. This >>>>> mail issue mushroomed, full-blown, from an update promised to improve, to >>>>> make simpler, to add features. >>>>> My experience has unfortunately invited an opposite opinion. No release >>>>> notes guided usage; it was just changed, just done and just not helpful >>>>> or easily usable. >>>>> It feels as though there is a tug-of-war between some who learned on that >>>>> clumsy, multi-step, multi-keyboard usage system and those using the iOs. >>>>> It is my opinion that the older, less easy OS needs to give place to the >>>>> more modern, more intuitive, more usable iOs and not the other way round. >>>>> Each update adds extra complications to iOS in the name of improvements. >>>>> There are a cadre of blind and sighted who, like the old friends at >>>>> rehab, insist on speaking for us, the user/consumer blind, for our own >>>>> good. >>>>> I recommend that all of us speak up in our own best interest or risk >>>>> losing something that could and did change the world for us. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Sep 15, 2016, at 15:27, David Chittenden <dchitten...@gmail.com >>>>> <mailto:dchitten...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Correct, the way messages are handled has changed. Visually, it now >>>>>> looks much more like mail on the mac. It also works more like macmail. >>>>>> >>>>>> When in the main message list, individual messages are still handled the >>>>>> same as in iOS 9. Threads are different. If one double-taps on a thread >>>>>> to activate it, one goes into a browse thread view. In this view, >>>>>> single-finger vertical flick moves up and down through the messages. >>>>>> Single-finger horrizontal flicks read through the specific message. >>>>>> Double-tap on the delete button at the bottom of the screen deletes all >>>>>> messages in the thread. Three-finger horrizontal flick moves between >>>>>> threads, threads and individual messages which do not belong to threads, >>>>>> and individual messages. In other words, the same as single-finger >>>>>> horrizontal flick in the message list screen. >>>>>> >>>>>> If one wishes to delete only some messages from a thread, the thread >>>>>> must be expanded. Whilst in the main message screen, single-finger >>>>>> vertical flick to expand thread and double-tap. Now, the thread is >>>>>> unpacked and all the messages in the thread are treated like non-thread >>>>>> messages. Now that I have become used to this new system, I really like >>>>>> it. It took me a few hours of frustration to become used to this new >>>>>> system. >>>>>> >>>>>> I am hoping that, as Apple continues merging the behaviours of apps for >>>>>> iOS and Mac, that we will see a full Mac-based iPad. I love touch-screen >>>>>> and want my touch-screen Mac, or the equivalent. >>>>>> >>>>>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA >>>>>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com <mailto:dchitten...@gmail.com> >>>>>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288 >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>> On 16/09/2016, at 10:09, Phil Halton <philh...@gmail.com >>>>>> <mailto:philh...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> message threading seems to have changed substantially in IOS10. I can >>>>>>> no longer 3 finger flick from message to message in a thread, instead I >>>>>>> have to use the “pre and next” message buttons. Also, the list of >>>>>>> messages in a thread no longer appears, but instead I am thrown into >>>>>>> the first message in the thread and then have to navigate between >>>>>>> messages using the next and pre message buttons. What a screw up this >>>>>>> is! is 3 finger flicking from message to message gone in ios10? >>>>>>> Also how about the thread message list? is that gone too? or are there >>>>>>> some settings that need tweaking? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac >>>>>>> Visionaries list. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, >>>>>>> or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact >>>>>>> the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list >>>>>>> itself. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is >>>>>>> Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com >>>>>>> <mailto:caraqu...@caraquinn.com> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The archives for this list can be searched at: >>>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ >>>>>>> <http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/> >>>>>>> --- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>>>> an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>>>>> <mailto:macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>>>>>> <mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>. >>>>>>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>. >>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac >>>>>> Visionaries list. >>>>>> >>>>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or >>>>>> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the >>>>>> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. >>>>>> >>>>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is >>>>>> Cara Quinn - 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you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com >>>> <mailto:caraqu...@caraquinn.com> >>>> >>>> The archives for this list can be searched at: >>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ >>>> <http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/> >>>> --- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>> <mailto:macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. >>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>>> <mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>. >>>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries >>>> <https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac >>> Visionaries list. >>> >>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if >>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners >>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. >>> >>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara >>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com >>> <mailto:caraqu...@caraquinn.com> >>> >>> The archives for this list can be searched at: >>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ >>> <http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/> >>> --- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>> <mailto:macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. >>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>> <mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>. >>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries >>> <https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. >> >> >> -- >> The following information is important for all members of the Mac >> Visionaries list. >> >> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if >> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or >> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. >> >> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara >> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com >> <mailto:caraqu...@caraquinn.com> >> >> The archives for this list can be searched at: >> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ >> <http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/> >> --- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MacVisionaries" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >> <mailto:macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >> <mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>. >> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries >> <https://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. > > I'm fundraising for RNIB. > > Please help me make a difference by making a donation to my Virgin Money > Giving page. > > To find out more about what I'm doing and why, please visit > http://www.virginmoneygiving.com/team/RNIBiceland > <http://www.virginmoneygiving.com/team/RNIBiceland> where you can also > sponsor me online. > > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if > you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or > moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara > Quinn - 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