I suspect the fact is that we are all more inter- connected than we know already, yet still talk and act as though we are not.
It seems to be that knowing both to be true is key What we need to engage with is kept silent and we may need laughter to reveal it because we are traumatised to silence through the politesse and etiquette of old arguments that serve to miss the point. I find this enormously insightful. I am not sure how to get at the kept silent. Kept silent as unseen, unknown - or something seen and known but feared into silence? Each would have a very different viewpoint. On Apr 28, 9:24 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > I didn't mean enlightenment per se Vam. Use of this term varies > greatly, as I'm sure we know. It's the business of attracting > individuals to enlightenment by those claiming to have achieved it and > who claim to recognise the talent or readiness in others to enter an > enlightened state as some kind of privilege that is the old, failed > fiction. I suspect much of this is connected to Plato's 3-part soul. > I haven't time to continue just now and can only say what an > enlightened world it would be if we were able to celebrate and > commiserate over an England or India victory in Peshawar - perhaps > with our grandchildren playing with local children in nearby gardens. > Cricket would, of course, be an irrelevance to whatever else had > happened to allow this. I can strategise what I mean rather than just > whine as a martyr. I suspect the fact is that we are all more inter- > connected than we know already, yet still talk and act as though we > are not. Globbalisation (no typo) is a case in point. I have a > feeling that wider attempts to describe life as lived (eg AutoGruff) > could help us work out the actual ground. > > On 28 Apr, 10:15, Vamadevananda <[email protected]> wrote: > > > This is a refreshing voice I hear from you, Neil ! Would like to hear > > of more depths neath what you are saying. LOL. > > > For one, what did you mean when you used the word " enlightenment ?" > > Why is it an " old, failed fiction ?" > > > On Apr 28, 10:37 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > [from C.S. Lewis 'The Screwtape Letters' - 1942] > > > It sounds as if you supposed that argument was the way to keep him out > > > of the Enemy's clutches. That might have been so had he lived a few > > > centuries earlier. At that time humans still knew pretty well when a > > > thing was proved and when it was not; and if it was proved they really > > > believed it. They still connected thinking with doing and were > > > prepared to alter their way of life as the result of a chain of > > > reasoning. But what with the weekly press and other such weapons we > > > have largely altered that. Your man has been accustomed, ever since > > > he was a boy, to have a dozen incompatible philosophies dancing about > > > inside his head. He doesn't think of doctrines as primarily "true" or > > > "false", but as "academic" or "practical", "outworn" or > > > "contemporary". "conventional" or "ruthless" ... Make him think it is > > > strong, or stark, or courageous - that is the philosophy of the > > > future. > > > > Lewis, of course, is taking the urine. The Enemy is The Church and he > > > is writing in irony (we perhaps know him better as the author of the > > > Biblical saga 'The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe'). Molly's World > > > would be very welcome, yet even in there we would have to be cautioned > > > against manipulation like the above and lingering Genghis Khans. Even > > > tolerance can turn into a dreadful weapon in human affairs. > > > Deconstruction, in part, teaches a key caution on the "objective- > > > bureaucratic voice" many confuse with dispassionate argument. It is > > > wary of engagement in any rush to knowledge, but has broadly failed to > > > spot its own rules of engagement - perhaps most farcically in its > > > plaudits to authors announcing the death of the author. > > > > Words are little in comparison with a desire to shake my friend Vam's > > > hand over a matter of simply decent engagement which would remain > > > silent in the embrace. It would be good if India or England had had a > > > close fought victory in cricket and both of us experienced the > > > meaningless history in buying a drink for the "loser". It might be > > > better still if the match was played in a Pakistan free of strife and > > > a world free of poverty - a poverty properly defined to understand the > > > poverty of Western "riches" as much as that of an Indian population > > > hoping politicians will put enough food on their tables and a roof > > > against what the sky brings. We need new arguments and action engaged > > > with them. The lack of this Slip, is my disappointment with an > > > academe that hacks out old nonsense, forever re-packaged - we should > > > be laughing at it but also reconstructing the chain of reason in > > > knowledge of its modern failures. In this sense, there is no need to > > > be ready for enlightenment as an individual, yet need to recognise > > > this is an old, failed fiction with much in common with dreadful > > > cosmetic adverts urging 'because you're worth it'. What we need to > > > engage with is kept silent and we may need laughter to reveal it > > > because we are traumatised to silence through the politesse and > > > etiquette of old arguments that serve to miss the point. > > > > On 27 Apr, 19:24, Tinker <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > God you Turn me On! > > > > > :-) > > > > peace & Love > > > > > On Apr 27, 11:18 am, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > Very good Molly, it is a recognition of the spark of life that > > > > > energizes the heartbeat, gives breath to the soul and allows for the > > > > > free mind. > > > > > > On Apr 27, 6:48 am, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > I think a person who voices this phrase is either in love with his > > > > > > golden shadow, found his godhood, or in a sleazy bar with his mind > > > > > > so > > > > > > blurred by mind altering substances that they haven't a clue as to > > > > > > what is really attractive. Knowing you, Slip, you have just come > > > > > > from > > > > > > a campfire where you were contemplating the finer things in life, > > > > > > so I > > > > > > guess, one of the first two would apply. > > > > > > > On Apr 26, 7:15 pm, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > Molly, what do you think of the expression, "God you Turn me On". > > > > > > > > On Apr 26, 3:38 pm, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > practically > > > > > > > > > On Apr 26, 4:00 pm, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I find arch to be creative with a humorous flair, a sort of > > > > > > > > > toying > > > > > > > > > with ideas, another dimension of linguistics, a provocation > > > > > > > > > of mind > > > > > > > > > and an experiment in mentalism. Possibly, one's repetitious > > > > > > > > > immersion > > > > > > > > > in academia livelihood has a dulling effect on extra dialectic > > > > > > > > > engagement. I'm always thankful for his presence in the > > > > > > > > > forum and > > > > > > > > > look forward to his contribution to my threads and posts. > > > > > > > > > Practically Signature Slip > > > > > > > > > > On Apr 26, 2:30 pm, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > and practically signature Orn to illustrate with authority. > > > > > > > > > > > On Apr 26, 3:15 pm, Chris Jenkins > > > > > > > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > It's practically signature Neal to deconstruct without > > > > > > > > > > > engaging. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 11:00 AM, ornamentalmind > > > > > > > > > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Neil, as is the case quite often, your post appears to > > > > > > > > > > > > be from a place > > > > > > > > > > > > of disillusionment. Not that I wish a Pollyannaish > > > > > > > > > > > > point of view, but > > > > > > > > > > > > with as much insight as you have, I have great hopes > > > > > > > > > > > > for future offers > > > > > > > > > > > > presenting more practice in wiping the excrement from > > > > > > > > > > > > those not so > > > > > > > > > > > > rose colored glasses. > > > > > > > > > > > > > The throw-away lines you like to close with, while > > > > > > > > > > > > containing a tad of > > > > > > > > > > > > a pedagogical Bill Porter (O. Henry), are so lightly > > > > > > > > > > > > presented as to > > > > > > > > > > > > become more ethereal than instructive. > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Apr 26, 1:28 am, archytas <[email protected]> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > >> We have two toilets, but also water rates. What is > > > > > > > > > > > >> given with one > > > > > > > > > > > >> hand is taken away with the other. Poverty easily > > > > > > > > > > > >> becomes the Monty > > > > > > > > > > > >> Python joke, until one sees real people living in a > > > > > > > > > > > >> 'shoe-box' in a > > > > > > > > > > > >> central reservation in Sao Paulo. In serious vein, we > > > > > > > > > > > >> are > > > > > > > > > > > >> overpopulating and producing spurious notions of > > > > > > > > > > > >> meritocracy and > > > > > > > > > > > >> democracy as merely superior forms of human resource > > > > > > > > > > > >> management. > > > > > > > > > > > >> One might see it this way: We are merely vessels for > > > > > > > > > > > >> the survival of > > > > > > > > > > > >> our genetic material. Thus one dominates the world > > > > > > > > > > > >> with CIA-assisted > > > > > > > > > > > >> marketing of banal but standardised software, steals > > > > > > > > > > > >> eggs from one's > > > > > > > > > > > >> partner, transplants one's DNA into such eggs and > > > > > > > > > > > >> speeds the result > > > > > > > > > > > >> off into the vastness, ensuring the survival of one's > > > > > > > > > > > >> DNA. There is > > > > > > > > > > > >> now no need for the human world at all. Victory is > > > > > > > > > > > >> assured as soon as > > > > > > > > > > > >> one gets a gullible politico to push a red button. > > > > > > > > > > > >> Quite what the > > > > > > > > > > > >> purpose of the triumph of one's DNA is in such > > > > > > > > > > > >> circumstances might get > > > > > > > > > > > >> more debate than it does. > > > > > > > > > > > > >> On 26 Apr, 05:30, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > Dang! I left out the toilet, my home has two full > > > > > > > > > > > >> > baths, I'm living > > > > > > > > > > > >> > like royalty!! > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > I'm going to borrow that Ghandi quote for the > > > > > > > > > > > >> > collective mentality > > > > > > > > > > > >> > thread, thanks! > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > On Apr 25, 11:14 pm, ornamentalmind > > > > > > > > > > > >> > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > A poster on the wall at work: > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > If your home has something other than a dirt floor > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > you are in the top > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > half of the world’s population. > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > If your home has a roof, a door, windows and more > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > than one room, you > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > are in the top 20%. > > ... > > read more » --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. 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