As critical as I am of the ‘democracy’ that I know, mostly with the intention of retaining and/or improving it, I am quite thankful that this lifetime was not spent in Cambodia or other such countries. The current experiment is preferable when a comparison to what is is conducted. And, when compared to the codified words “…in order to form a more perfect union…”, the ongoing process is seen and must be recognized. I do.
On Oct 1, 9:26 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > We like to think of the UK Parliament as the 'mother of parliaments'. > We are much the same in sport - always resting on our history of > inventing the games others now beat us at! Most civilised countries > seem more democratic than Britain, but I only ever visit or live in > them as an alien. In France, in the late 70's I discovered my > illusions were just that as police and troops laid waste to a shanty > town with bulldozers and I found out how casual labour was treated (I > was undercover on a drugs bust). The US has always seemed so much > more democratic with all kinds of elections we don't have - yet it > generally is not. > I actually find a lot not to like about democracy - the Athenian one > had a privileged Demos and practised ethnic cleansing of an economic > kind we see in Domesday Books all over the world - and there are > obvious problems such as asking the uninformed to make decisions. > This latter is a key problem as it lets in charisma and all the old > techniques of persuasion because we can always rely on the majority > not to be able to follow the argument. The Germans were probably the > best educated, most scientific, most cultured people on the planet > when they voted for Hitler and the Nazis. Hitler may have seized > power illegitimately, but Germans voted for him in droves in elections > around the country. Other countries had their own Nazis in > considerable numbers. We will vote for any dross - this should make > us rethink democracy. > > On 1 Oct, 17:00, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > Sadly, I couldn’t get tickets to hear Noam here in Portland this > > week. > > > And, I have found that he gets much of what you say we should fear > > right Neil. He just isn’t quite as charismatic in his brand of > > ‘evangelism’ as some though. > > > I fear we in the Colonies are at the cusp of yet another Civil War… > > only not so ‘Civil’. The ‘best’ political action my disillusioned > > brain can imagine at this time, other than a true ‘new’ tea party, is > > to fulfill the ancient cry of ‘Throw the bums out!’. I was skeptical > > about the actuality of the BO regime from the start and now that the > > ‘party in power’ has vetoed health care for we the people and has > > reinvested in the demonstrated failed practice of sexual abstinence as > > well as a continued hegemony, it really is time for change. Eisenhower > > was much wiser. > > > As a sort of Paul Revere of the day, I call upon ‘we the people’ to > > see that every political person in power is replaced...with 3rd party > > individuals if possible. There is no other way to gain political > > attention today. This even though I fully embrace Noam’s notion of > > Anarchy: > > > “…Anarchism, in my view, is an expression of the idea that the burden > > of proof is always on those who argue that authority and domination > > are necessary. They have to demonstrate, with powerful argument, that > > that conclusion is correct. If they cannot, then the institutions they > > defend should be considered illegitimate. How one should react to > > illegitimate authority depends on circumstances and conditions: there > > are no formulas. …” – Chomsky > > > (more at:http://www.chomsky.info/interviews/19961223.htm) > > > On Oct 1, 7:24 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Chomsky has been right for many years. The academy in which he and > > > others flourished is long gone - we are all, at our relative levels of > > > ability in the margins as resistance fighters. I would put the > > > argument personally given limited space. An old guy (undoubtedly a > > > 'comrade') turned up at our door a couple of days ago. Sue and I are > > > died in the wool lefties and he was asking if Labour could rely on our > > > vote. I didn't want to upset the old chap. Our MP isn't fit for the > > > job, our councillors useless, almost childish. Britain is broken - > > > there is no system worth voting in. We'd like to be able to vote in a > > > space for radical reform for the establishment of actual democracy. > > > We're nearly 60 years old, let down by false promises and the default > > > return of business as usual however we vote. We are at war and can't > > > even vote against this. Etc. etc. ... even the old 'sense' of a > > > pragmatic choice in a dirty world doesn't work on us - this was part > > > of the broken promises. It's conference season here, with a general > > > election coming in 6 months. The old dross is rolled out by all. The > > > Prime Minister's wife makes a speech blessing him as 'her hero' - the > > > only indication I can draw from this is the public is still regarded > > > as gullible and pathetic. > > > > The job is one of anarchy - the tearing down of the lies on 'free > > > trade'. 'democracy' and so on - but the aim is not anarchy (strictly > > > meaning leaderlessness) - it's about new construction free of the > > > chronic fears we have about each other. What Chomsky isn't good on is > > > recognising much we should be fearful of - crap worlds of the veil, > > > 'dumb idealism', the ease in which tyranny can establish unless we get > > > armed services and policing right, 'dumb meritocracy' and so on. > > > I saw the NATO speech on Afghanistan today - the general could almost > > > have been a sociologist in explaining how 'our' (not in my name) > > > actions rub against Afghan culture. Building a well in the wrong > > > place with the wrong labour leads to changes in the balance of power, > > > killing two insurgents may lead to another ten joining up for > > > revenge. Is any of this surprising when our own legal systems favour > > > the rich, exclude most of us from justice and can't even free disabled > > > people from local 'terrorists' who bully them to suicide? Much of > > > this was discussed by Hobbes and Thomas Moore. How many coups start > > > as temporary takeovers that will bring democracy (the dictatorship of > > > the proletariat syndrome)? How did 'democracy' as we might grudgingly > > > admit to take root? Not by watching television and playing video > > > games. > > > > If I finish my books and they sell well, what will I do? Get myself a > > > 'stable of broads', flash cars and learn to fiddle in the comfort of > > > watching the world burn from my comfort away from it all? I want none > > > of such 'success' - though know its temptations. Many live in > > > conditions where much more minor temptations can be used to effect > > > 'revolution'. I would rather die than be the white man on the beach > > > in Kenya forking out a few dollars for sex with a local child. In > > > fact, I don't have to travel far to discover this 'down the road', or > > > in the actions of those defending Polanski. Polanski gets a bevy of > > > lawyers, the kid he raped at 13 did not get help when she needed it. > > > > Democracy is not simply about empowering all - it requires a wrecking > > > of the illegitimate use of authority whilst building means to our > > > security itself properly amenable to law and due process. I have seen > > > 'hunger thieves' too often and our systems render us all 'hungry' for > > > the wrong things - there is a need to work out how to base Chomsky on > > > what humans currently are - in order that we might be something very > > > different. > > > > On 1 Oct, 14:06, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > This latest article from Noam Chomsky - Crisis and Hope: Theirs and > > > > Ours > > > > > Of all of the crises that afflict us, the growing democratic deficit > > > > may be the most severe. Unless it is reversed, Roy's forecast may > > > > prove accurate. The conversion of democracy to a performance with the > > > > public as mere spectators -- hardly a distant possibility -- might > > > > have truly dire consequences... > > > > > An immediate goal is to pressure Congress to permit organizing rights, > > > > the Employee Free Choice Act that was promised but seems to be > > > > languishing. One short-term goal is to support the revival of a strong > > > > and independent labor movement, which in its heyday was a critical > > > > base for advancing democracy and human and civil rights, a primary > > > > reason why it has been subject to such unremitting attack in policy > > > > and propaganda. A longer-term goal is to win the educational and > > > > cultural battle that has been waged with such bitterness in the "one- > > > > sided class war" that the UAW president perceived far too late. That > > > > means tearing down an enormous edifice of delusions about markets, > > > > free trade, and democracy that has been assiduously constructed over > > > > many years and to overcome the marginalization and atomization of the > > > > public so that they can become "participants," not mere "spectators of > > > > action," as progressive democratic theoreticians have prescribed. > > > > > In his article, Chomsky lays out several pressing crisis of the day, > > > > but concludes that a deficit in democracy is the most severe. The > > > > entire article can be seen on his website > > > > here:http://www.chomsky.info/articles/200909--.htm > > > > > What do YOU think?- Hide quoted text - > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. 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