The Pagan gods and goddesses were no saints either! :-)
On Oct 24, 12:43 pm, retiredjim34 <[email protected]> wrote:
> Archy - good issues to wonder about.
> I'd go back a bit further than Jesus and also wonder about God,
> at least the God of the Bible. Would you, coming at this whole topic
> afresh, choose to believe in a God that told his first beliver
> (Abraham) to take his son out back and kill him, who to win a bet gave
> the Devil the power to do all sorts of bad stuff to one of God's most
> devoted belivers (Job) and who to redeem mankind put his only son here
> to die a death of prolonged torture? Is that the sort of God any
> rational person would believe in? I guess so, because there seem to be
> a lot of rational people who do. But how about you? Jim
>
> On Oct 23, 6:52 pm, archytas <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > I always start by wondering what I would think if ordinary Joe told me
> > the stories and also about the way I am easily conned by magic before
> > (and often after) I see the way the trick is done. I'm also inclined
> > to think copying and plagiarism is rife and was then. I notice much
> > talk of heroes is elaborated, so why am I expected to think
> > differently of religious stuff. Lies, illusions and fantasies can be
> > found daily - some modern Freudians even say they don't help clients
> > find the truth even if this is what they are looking for, but offer a
> > better organisation of their fections (I'll leave this in memory of
> > Father Ted!).
> > Personally, I doubt Jesus is a historical figure - more likely there
> > were many. I'd say the key issue is how we come to believe what is
> > mostly snake oil (the satanic abuse scandals in the UK make
> > fascinating reading on how phoney experts from abroad can influence
> > apparently sane cops and social workers) and how we are so influenced
> > today. I have no problem with wandering cynics seeking to change
> > society, and like many Greeks before me, have a sign saying they are
> > welcome above my door. The question as to whether Jesus owned his
> > clothes is a good one whether one needs to believe in him as the son
> > of God or not.
>
> > On 23 Oct, 23:02, Manfraco Frank the Elder <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > Hi allan and others!
> > > Allan, your post could be very interesting for me and I am going to
> > > follow it very closely, I know I am not very learned like some of you;
> > > but I have got my own ideas or religious beliefs which need to be
> > > tuned in before I can express them more openly. I am sure that if one
> > > takes away parts of the stories which only embellish the gospels it
> > > may have very different meanings; but you have to be very careful
> > > about that if you believe in anything at all; you see you have to defy
> > > your own religious beliefs and be strong enough to change the gospel.
> > > Please, read the very end of the Bible, where there is a sort of curse
> > > if anyone changes anything. Are you willing to chance that?
> > > Send you all my regards
> > > Manfraco
>
> > > On Oct 24, 4:57 am, iam deheretic <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > I have often wondered what the new testament of the bible would be
> > > > like if
> > > > you removed the parts that are in reality are made up short stories
> > > > used to
> > > > sell a bill of goods. An example(s) being the nativity stories, the
> > > > resurrection (misunderstood,) the writings of Saul Of Tarsus the
> > > > book of
> > > > revelations. to name a few
>
> > > > I wonder if a book (it would probably be very short) getting rid of the
> > > > exact interpretation but rather trying to expressed express the ideas
> > > > that
> > > > Jesus the man best wanted to express. I look at our group and the
> > > > atheists
> > > > and agnostics have a very valuable role in working out that validity of
> > > > what
> > > > is being said. There is a definite need to counter balance my own
> > > > beliefs
> > > > and those of other fanatics.
>
> > > > To tell the truth this would be a total dream for me. There is an event
> > > > astronomically that can be dated like a total solar eclipse over
> > > > Jerusalem
> > > > in 33 CE. I do know that there are religious fanatics in the Philippines
> > > > that are crucified (literally) and they regularly survive it. I think
> > > > these
> > > > things need to be taken into account, from what I understand it actually
> > > > takes several days to die that way.
>
> > > > Here I have to admit I am jealous of the sheer enlightenment of
> > > > spiritual
> > > > knowledge Francis and other members of this group possess. I am hoping
> > > > they
> > > > will take to this idea.
> > > > Allan
>
> > > > (
> > > > )
> > > > I_D Allan- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
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