Good point. I think collective anger does manifest, and shows itself in global catastrophy and fearful myth. It seems to me your image is inverted Neil. At the level of the larger stuff, anger manifests in the alluring distraction from the path of that good, honest relationship with self. On the level of smaller stuff, the opposition keeps us separated, our own need to revel in the negative value of things, feel the injury and despair. If we can reconcille the opposites, the larger and the smaller are quiet the same, and express as One. Here, honesty is unquestionable, the natural flow. Because we can only have this view with the complete embrace of it, and reconcilliation of large and small levels.
On Mar 4, 12:53 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > I agree with Francis at the smaller level of stuff. I just feel a > kind of collective anger might manifest in flowers down gunbarrels > sort of things if we weren't so separated. > > On 4 Mar, 02:29, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > “If we didn't live venturously, plucking the wild goat by the beard, > > and trembling over precipices, we should never be depressed, I've no > > doubt; but already should be faded, fatalistic and aged.” - Virginia > > Woolf > > > On Mar 3, 7:51 pm, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote:> I think it is all > > pertinent to all of us Arch, the cog in the wheel > > > thing. It is no longer a day of lolling in some pastoral scene eating > > > wild berries and grapes near the crystal clear stream. Few get to > > > realize their dreams and so as you say the rest us are forced to live > > > their dreams. We therefore engross ourselves in the celebrity > > > > circus and the arenas of sport challenge, somehow through identity > > > with them we find some sense of achievement and success. > > > I have to say that I don't spend much time in a depressed mode due to > > > the fact that, using Don's offering, I schedule my time so that I have > > > plenty of it to do what I want, I decide in the morning what I want > > > to do for the day and if I don't want to do anything I don't. I get > > > many comments at market and other places telling me that I am always > > > happy, and this lets me know that it does work. I can see and feel > > > the sadness that people live with, the burdens that are suppressed, so > > > even if I can give a moment of laughter or just elevate the mood for > > > that wee bit of time, I know it may help. I have to say that I don't > > > take life all the seriously, I have no expectations based on action as > > > I really think that anything can happen at any time. Live today and > > > die tomorrow, that is all we can do, the earth may open up and swallow > > > us, a bomb may be dropped down, or a truck may just run us down while > > > crossing the street, sadly it is now possible that some insane gunman > > > may go off on some sniper rampage. If I enjoyed today then I'm a step > > > ahead. Many have devoted 30 years to a company and have nothing to > > > show for it. > > > I have spent a great deal of time in "down time" mode. Sure it cost > > > me marriage and lifestyle at times but then again other times proved > > > to be more rewarding. We're taking holiday tomorrow and traipsing > > > about the hillsides gathering in the scenery, a stop for lunch at a > > > micro brewery, some photo taking and who knows what. Let the sun > > > shine, its going to be a great day. Oh and try to remember your > > > "not" a bee! > > > > On Mar 3, 10:51 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > You got to a lot that might matter to me above Slip. I suspect I go > > > > some way with Orn and certainly recognise what Darkwater is saying. > > > > Perhaps strangely for a materialist (only where things start in > > > > analysis for me), I think we are forced to live in the dreams of > > > > others. > > > > I would like to know what 'down time' is - even the 'busy bee' spends > > > > most of its life in such, despite our inappropriate metaphor. > > > > > On 3 Mar, 15:53, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > In most situations, even professionals are not competent in expressing > > > > > this Dark. We each, who care, merely do our best. Looking back over my > > > > > lifetime, I now am aware that on numerous occasions, when I thought I > > > > > was doing good…the actual result was the opposite. Wisdom is rare. > > > > > > On Mar 3, 6:49 am, DarkwaterBlight <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > "These antidotes are in > > > > > > fact little more than a better understanding of what we are and what > > > > > > our processes are along with our purpose." - Orn > > > > > > > I toally agree with this! How does one express this to the one who > > > > > > is > > > > > > afflicted though? > > > > > > I have had personal relationship(s) in which my mate would > > > > > > fall > > > > > > into episodes of deep depression. My initial response to such > > > > > > episodes > > > > > > would be to try to "lighten the air" a bit, in order to distract her > > > > > > from this rumination. Consequently it was like salt or vinager on a > > > > > > wound. So it is when singing songs to a heavy heart I guess. Trying > > > > > > to > > > > > > discuss the problem seemed as though it was useless and as if my > > > > > > efforts would compound things even more. Despite my empathy, I would > > > > > > be accused of "not understanding" and being unable to relate. It > > > > > > wasn't long before I became the object of her scorn and the supposed > > > > > > cause of her woes even though I had been a temporary remedy early > > > > > > on. > > > > > > Drugs helped alot, but I don't do them any more;-)! > > > > > > > On Mar 3, 7:05 am, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > Slip, I too agree that depression is ‘normal’ in the sense that > > > > > > > it is > > > > > > > the common human experience. I also agree that drugs are not > > > > > > > indicated > > > > > > > unless one wishes to use them. > > > > > > > > Beyond this truth though, and without wishing to be evangelical > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > many here are, I do strongly suggest that there are antidotes to > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > vast majority of depressive manifestations. These antidotes are in > > > > > > > fact little more than a better understanding of what we are and > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > our processes are along with our purpose. > > > > > > > > On Mar 3, 12:49 am, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Probably one of the most debilitating aspects of depression is > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > implication that it is a bad thing in need of treatment. It is > > > > > > > > most > > > > > > > > likely just the obverse condition of exuberance, which one > > > > > > > > would not > > > > > > > > expect to be engaged in full throttle at all times. If there > > > > > > > > is cause > > > > > > > > for the lapse then we might consider it a natural remedy, a > > > > > > > > coping > > > > > > > > mechanism. I've often slept away several days and emerged like > > > > > > > > a hard > > > > > > > > drive that's gone through the series of file scans and > > > > > > > > defragmentation. The only notion of being depressed comes from > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > outside world defining it as such, they sell drugs that way. > > > > > > > > Sadness > > > > > > > > is normal and a part of our reverence to things gone by or a > > > > > > > > loss of > > > > > > > > anything important. We've been sold on joy and happiness to > > > > > > > > the point > > > > > > > > of not recognizing that being down is as necessary. We can't > > > > > > > > spend > > > > > > > > all our time in the awake state, we have to sleep, rest and > > > > > > > > rejuvenate, reorganize. This is the primary function of > > > > > > > > depression > > > > > > > > and of course I think it needs a new name. We've been pushed > > > > > > > > out of > > > > > > > > our bio rhythms for so long by social systems that we forget > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > being down is simply natural. There is no longer any time to > > > > > > > > be down > > > > > > > > because we are in a constant state of motion, one that dictates > > > > > > > > we > > > > > > > > operate routinely and function in a robotic way. The world is > > > > > > > > noise. > > > > > > > > > On Mar 2, 5:01 pm, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > One of the most challenging aspects of studying depression is > > > > > > > > > the vast > > > > > > > > > amount of contradiction in the literature. Virtually every > > > > > > > > > claim comes > > > > > > > > > with a contradictory claim, which is also supported by > > > > > > > > > evidence. I > > > > > > > > > tend to believe this confusion will persist until our > > > > > > > > > definitions of > > > > > > > > > depression become more precise, so that intense sadness and > > > > > > > > > paralyzing, chronic, suicidal despair are no longer lumped > > > > > > > > > together in > > > > > > > > > the same psychiatric category. (Lehrer) > > > > > > > > > > I've been 'depressed' since middle teenage, with some bouts of > > > > > > > > > clinical depression, partly associated with trauma. I've had > > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > periods I'd call madness, and though I have never done > > > > > > > > > anything > > > > > > > > > 'serious' have found myself out of control at times in some > > > > > > > > > sort of > > > > > > > > > desperate way. I can claim some fairly good achievements in > > > > > > > > > such > > > > > > > > > periods, but mostly they are debilitating rather than manic > > > > > > > > > periods. > > > > > > > > > I'm coming out of difficult times at the moment and am almost > > > > > > > > > 'champing at the bit', but really screwed by being physically > > > > > > > > > crook. > > > > > > > > > I'm about to force myself to write and 'get straight' and just > > > > > > > > > beginning to feel it will work. Lehrer may help - the blog > > > > > > > > > is good. > > > > > > > > > > On 2 Mar, 01:41, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Rigsby, > > > > > > > > > > Slip and I have been tangentially discussing this in the > > > > > > > > > > Robert > > > > > > > > > > Thurman post. We both want to digest it and come back here > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > discussion. Very interesting. > > > > > > > > > > > On 28 Feb, 03:00, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I meant to respond sooner Riggers, but was too depressed! > > > > > > > > > > > True > > > > > > > > > > > sadly! There is little not to be depressed about in > > > > > > > > > > > contemplation of > > > > > > > > > > > the human condition. I would like to believe that a > > > > > > > > > > > world more > > > > > > > > > > > engaged with truth and knowledge would help prevent this, > > > > > > > > > > > but know > > > > > > > > > > > many people who don't want to contemplate reality because > > > > > > > > > > > it is too > > > > > > > > > > > painful. > > > > > > > > > > > > On 27 Feb, 13:18, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Depression's Upside" By Jonah Lehrer > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/28/magazine/28depression-t.html-Hidequ... > > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en.
