On 3 Mar, 17:42, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: > Pascal's wager is fundamentally flawed. It assumes one has a choice > in what one believes. This is rarely the case. Unless you are > suggesting we fake it? For the good of man? Nah, too much work. > > dj >
No, I agree with you 100% that the implied choice is in err. Space- time offers no choices, but it offers a chance to speculate without knowing the future, which appears as 'choice'. I have no doubt whatsoever that I will do that which I will do (and I know that is true for everyone else, as well). The key is that I don't know what those things are, yet. But I'll do them. No I'm not suggesting anyone fake anything. Rather, I was suggesting that before Fiddler wishes that others think like him, that he be sure of what he thinks, and I know that he's not. He may state otherwise, but can offer no empirical evidence to vack up the conclusions he's drawn anymore than I can. He can wish for himself what he likes, I only take issue with what he selfishly wishes for others with complete disregard FOR them. > > > On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 11:32 AM, Pat <[email protected]> wrote: > > > On 3 Mar, 16:51, fiddler <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Actually, there was a specific sect that felt Ra to be the all- > >> important and the other egyptian gods to be merely helpers. Just > >> because I reference a deity, does not mean that I'm referencing the > >> largest known base of worshippers beliefs. > > >> As for being wrong, you're argument seems to be nothing more than > >> pascale's moronic wager. "If I'm wrong" then I'm being mean to others > >> so I should be nice and support every mythology I can find? > > > So, basically, it's your own pride, then, that's the issue at stake, > > if Pascal's wager is too costly for you. I had already come to that > > conclusion, but it's better if you state it yourself, even if you do > > try to disguise it. There a part of me, like that similar part of > > you, that kind of feels sorry for you. But, I know that if I'm wrong, > > I've lost nothing, whereas you lose everything. As for being 'nice', > > I would have thought that an 'ethical' issue and not related to theism > > in any way, yet you link the two. Interesting...if not confounding. > > Rather, you should endeavour to think carefully before uttering any > > wish for others and think about the possible consequences when you > > KNOW that your own beliefs are based on the same profound lack of > > empirical evidence as those whom you seem to view as 'the > > opposition'. Not to mention 'equal and opposite reactions' that you > > know you can count on. > > >> On Mar 3, 4:33 am, Pat <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> > On 2 Mar, 17:48, fiddler <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> > > No, I don't fear an afterlife. I generally don't engage in the "what > >> > > if" because far too many people say "AH HA, See! You do think about > >> > > it!!" or some other silly statement. > >> > > I will make an exception for you. > > >> > > If Ra is found to be true and calls me to accounting, I will fair > >> > > poorly. I'm photo-sensitive and generally don't like the sun. I'm also > >> > > far more comfortable in cold temperatures than hot. I think that he > >> > > wouldn't appreciate me much. > > >> > Good answer. Although it was a nice turn-of-play to name a particular > >> > deity and draw a comparison, you seem to forget that Ra doesn't judge > >> > in the Egyptian Mythos, that comes down to Anubis, who weighs your > >> > heart against the feather of truth (Maat) LONG before you'd get the > >> > chance to see Ra. If you're going to argue within a mythos, then you > >> > should, at least, know enough about it to employ it properly. But > >> > then, I wouldn't really expect you to come across intellectually > >> > regarding those things about which you, admittedly, know little about. > > >> > That said, I gave some thought about your statement "My only impotent > >> > wish (prayer) is that there would be a period just before death that > >> > religious people could realise that life is just over and no sky- > >> > fairie will justify a wasted existence." I get from that that you > >> > would prefer people to come to YOUR senses rather than come to their > >> > own. However, you've failed to consider that your own belief may, > >> > 'just as' easily be erroneous, as it, too, is based on no evidence. > >> > Consider, for a moment that you are, in fact, wrong. To hold such a > >> > wish would be to deprive the masses of the one thing that can help > >> > them for all eternity and THAT is about the most heinous and cold- > >> > hearted desire that I think I've ever read on this group. Top ratings > >> > for that. > > >> > Remember, Anubis weighs the heart and, if it doesn't weigh evenly, > >> > your heart is passed to Ammit, the Devourer of Souls, where she may > >> > either eat it (forcing you to die a second death) or cast it into a > >> > lake of fire in which you would burn eternally. Not too much > >> > different from modern concepts of Hell. > > >> > > On Mar 2, 9:26 am, Pat <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> > > > On 19 Feb, 19:46, fiddler <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> > > > > No, I don't. You keep saying this to quite a few people, it seems > >> > > > > true > >> > > > > for none of them. I do not pray I'm right anymore than I pray to > >> > > > > avoid > >> > > > > menopause or ovarian cancer. Not only is there more evidence that > >> > > > > I'm > >> > > > > correct (thus removing the silliness of prayer from the equation), > >> > > > > there is no evidence at all for souls, gods, fairies, or > >> > > > > onenesses. My > >> > > > > only impotent wish (prayer) is that there would be a period just > >> > > > > before death that religious people could realise that life is just > >> > > > > over and no sky-fairie will justify a wasted existence. > > >> > > > My statement had a little smiling face indicating I was jibing you. > >> > > > I > >> > > > expect that your wish, then, will fall on deaf ears. Do you fear an > >> > > > afterlife? Assuming, for argument's sake, that there is one, how do > >> > > > you think you'd fare? > > >> > > > > On Feb 19, 3:40 am, Pat <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> > > > > > On 18 Feb, 15:20, fiddler <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> > > > > > > no there won't > > >> > > > > > So you pray!! ;-) > > >> > > > > > > On Feb 18, 5:03 am, Pat <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> > > > > > > > On 18 Feb, 04:25, fiddler <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> > > > > > > > > sorry slip, I'm not a theist. I don't give up because a > >> > > > > > > > > bronze age > >> > > > > > > > > goatherder said so or take some schizophrenics word for > >> > > > > > > > > complete > >> > > > > > > > > knowledge of "truth." I did hear that a oneness said > >> > > > > > > > > something or > >> > > > > > > > > other to a guy named firm-palm-touch... of course that > >> > > > > > > > > particular > >> > > > > > > > > theist won't publish the idea in a peer-reviewed journal... > > >> > > > > > > > That would, of course, be because there isn't a peer-review > >> > > > > > > > table of > >> > > > > > > > existing, recognised prophets. Don't waste time on being > >> > > > > > > > sorry you're > >> > > > > > > > not a theist now, Fidd. There'll be plenty of time for that > >> > > > > > > > later. ;-) > > >> > > > > > > > > On Feb 17, 7:52 pm, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> > > > > > > > > > It doesn't really matter fidd, we're only heading toward > >> > > > > > > > > > a nuclear > >> > > > > > > > > > holocaust anyway and the threat of such is currently > >> > > > > > > > > > escalating. > >> > > > > > > > > > Haven't you heard? It's already documented in the > >> > > > > > > > > > space-time > >> > > > > > > > > > continuum; we just haven't received the bulletin yet. > > >> > > > > > > > > > On Feb 17, 9:38 pm, fiddler <[email protected]> > >> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Possibly the only true death penalty/unforgivable > >> > > > > > > > > > > crime category: the > >> > > > > > > > > > > poaching of fellow primates and destruction of habitat > >> > > > > > > > > > > for our > >> > > > > > > > > > > cousins. How long until we are the only african ape? > >> > > > > > > > > > > Too damn long for > >> > > > > > > > > > > poachers and witch-doctors. > > >> > > > > > > > > > >http://www.cnn.com/2010/TECH/science/02/17/endangered.species/index.h... > > >> > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > >> > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > >> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > >> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > >> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > >> - Show quoted text - > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > ""Minds Eye"" group. > > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > [email protected]. > > For more options, visit this group > > athttp://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en.- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. 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