Everthing that is born is finite as it will certainly die. The universe was born with the Big Bang and will disintegrate with the big Crunch. All life is dualistic in nature, as a movie needs a screen consciousness needs a sense. If the universe is continuously expanding it doesn't mean that it will never disintegrate. To equate God with the universe , is doubting his existence and you may as well consider yourself to be athiests. If a hen can come out of an egg and god is still there, then the universe can come out of the cosmic egg and God be still there.
On May 4, 12:58 pm, DarkwaterBlight <[email protected]> wrote: > "God is pure consciousness, formless, unborn, eternal, indestructible > and the source, the spirit and the end of all. We are conscious, have > a form, are born, live and die. Our only solace is that we arise from > him, are upheld by him and go back to him. He is the Truth and we are > just his reflections and vanish when the vessel dies."-RP > > I have to refer back to the origional post to respond to this.If God > is the source then the big bang does not really count for much in this > discussion. Furthermore, as the theory has evolved we find (and these > are assumptions of course)that the universe is continually expanding > and likely to expand infinitly. Also, if others are correct in their > posts which state the universe and God are one and we are part of this > universe (also assuming anything, in fact, exists) than we are not > finite but infinite as well. Therefore arising from Him, being upheld > by Him and going back to Him we become one with the eternal and the > only thing that is dualistic is our perception of what is 'real' ie; > the physical being or the vessel as you put it. I will go so far as > saying that what we percieve as real is less real than what we cannot > measure ie; the ethereal. > > On May 4, 1:08 pm, RP <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > The universe started developing with the big bang and will > > disintegrate at some time in the future. Duality is always finite. God > > alone is infinite as he is non-dual. > > > On May 4, 7:39 am, DarkwaterBlight <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > "The "gods " would then just be super-beings who will be born with > > > this > > > universe and die with it , e.i. dualistic in nature"-RP > > > > This would assume that the universe is finite, no? I fail to see the > > > logic here. > > > > On May 3, 10:14 am, RP <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > The "gods " would then just be super-beings who will be born with this > > > > universe and die with it , e.i. dualistic in nature. > > > > > On May 3, 5:42 am, [email protected] wrote: > > > > > > Ifpure consciousness transcends human awareness then as Kant > > > > > saysthe assertion of unity is only a hypothesis believed as an > > > > > article offaith. What if the pre Greeks are righter about the nature > > > > > of realitywith their notion of multiple "gods" a multiplicity of > > > > > realities? > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: RP <[email protected]> > > > > > To: "Minds Eye" <[email protected]> > > > > > Sent: Mon, May 3, 2010 8:05 am > > > > > Subject: [Mind's Eye] Re: God and I > > > > > > Pure Consciousness, God, Atma , or the Self is non-dual and above > > > > > awareness. Awareness implies dualism as it is not possible otherwise. > > > > > The entire creation which is dualistic in nature springs from the non- > > > > > dual and is like a hen coming out of an egg. i.e. all predetermined. I > > > > > know that I have no company in this view , yet I have expressed it as > > > > > basically I am truthful in nature. > > > > > > On May 2, 8:14 am, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > “OM , most people don't want to die…” – RP > > > > > > > > > > > > While I don’t know ‘most people’ nor their wants and desires, the > > > > > > human organism as well as psyche does have a drive for life. > > > > > > > > > > > > “… or have so many desires like psychic powers …” – RP > > > > > > > > > > > > Again, I have no experience with ‘most people’ so do not know > > > > > what > > > > > > they want. As to psychic powers, it is true that I’ve heard > > > > > precious > > > > > > little from most of the people that I do know about psychic > > > > > powers. > > > > > > However, I cannot say the same about them having desires. It > > > > > appears > > > > > > that most people I know have quite a set of passions and > > > > > desires. . . > > > > > > attachments to all sorts of issues, things, attributes, hungers > > > > > etc. > > > > > > I make no value judgment about such things other than that which > > > > > I > > > > > > know…such thirsts do attract suffering. > > > > > > > > > > > > “…that they make so much of consciousness.” – RP > > > > > > > > > > > > And, my closer friends do have a focus on consciousness while my > > > > > > acquaintances do not share much about consciousness itself. > > > > > > > > > > > > “… In my view there is only God, Atma Or Pure Consciousness. We > > > > > are > > > > > > all just his > > > > > > reflections or have emanated from him…” – RP > > > > > > > > > > > > When observing things ultimate, I’d say we are of like minds > > > > > here RP… > > > > > > at the very least, have similar points of view. > > > > > > > > > > > > “… Maybe my reasoning is awry and you and others are right…” – RP > > > > > > > > > > > > If you are associating this response with my last post, I see no > > > > > > contradiction. Perhaps there was a misunderstanding. The > > > > > ‘reasoning’ I > > > > > > criticized had to do with how I interpreted your words > > > > > > > > > > > > “..It would be simply a state of coma.Go and ask for general > > > > > > anaesthesia for a few minutes, that would be your self- > > > > > > realisation. ..” – RP > > > > > > > > > > > > Now, perhaps here it is I who don’t quite interpret your meaning > > > > > > correctly. Only you will be the judge of that. Your above words, > > > > > to > > > > > > me, imply no awareness when self-realized…only “a state of > > > > > coma”. From > > > > > > what little experience I have here and what I have read from > > > > > those who > > > > > > have taken this path over the millennia, while we are living and > > > > > > associated with a specific body (not dead), even though specific > > > > > > states of consciousness can come and go where one is not > > > > > attached to > > > > > > ‘self’ nor appearances, there must be and is a consubstantial > > > > > > recognition of both the absolute (no words/concepts) as well as > > > > > the > > > > > > “I”…that which thinks, has emotions etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > “… But in that case also I am right, You will become one with > > > > > God when > > > > > > you get salvation and then there will be no individual I , as > > > > > far as > > > > > > you will be concerned. If I am not mistaken , you at least > > > > > believe in > > > > > > predeterminism , like me.” – RP > > > > > > > > > > > > Many issues in this small set of words RP…first, I’m not so sure > > > > > that > > > > > > the issue of being ‘right’ is that important to me here. I > > > > > wanted to > > > > > > discuss and share with you. We may not agree and this is fine. > > > > > We in > > > > > > fact may be fully agreeing and don’t know it due to the use of > > > > > > subjective words and terms. There are many possibilities here. > > > > > As to > > > > > > one becoming ‘one with god’…I find that to be the case for > > > > > everyone … > > > > > > primarily demonstrated by divine omnipresence. Now, the term of > > > > > > salvation doesn’t seem to enter into the discussion for me…at > > > > > least > > > > > > not when it comes to terminology. Perhaps you can elucidate > > > > > here. As > > > > > > to an ‘individual I’, we are in agreement in one sense at least. > > > > > I > > > > > > find that the common notion of ‘I’, ego etc., in any ultimate > > > > > sense is > > > > > > not real. However, since I and apparently most other human > > > > > beings do > > > > > > notice and recognize a ‘self’, whether it is mere appearances or > > > > > not, > > > > > > to ignore ‘I’ doesn’t seem to be the proper path to take. > > > > > Lastly, as > > > > > > to predeterminism, in one sense, yes, we share a similar view if > > > > > not > > > > > > the same. That is such a large topic that I won’t delve into it > > > > > at > > > > > > this time though. > > > > > > > > > > > > On May 1, 8:22 pm, RP <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > OM , most people don't want to die or have so many desires > > > > > like > > > > > > > psychic powers that they make so much of consciousness. In > > > > > my view > > > > > > > there is only God, Atma Or Pure Consciousness. We are all > > > > > just his > > > > > > > reflections or have emanated from him. Maybe my reasoning > > > > > is awry and > > > > > > > you and others are right. But in that case also I am right, > > > > > You will > > > > > > > become one with God when you get salvation and then there > > > > > will be no > > > > > > > individual I , as far as you will be concerned. If I am not > > > > > mistaken , > > > > > > > you at least believe in predeterminism , like me. > > > > > > > On May 1, 4:57 pm, ornamentalmind > > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > “…There would be no I as that also requires > > > > > > > > some sort of sense. There would be no thought as it > > > > > would require a > > > > > > > > memory of words or sound. It would be simply a state > > > > > of coma…” – RP > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RP, thanks for responding to what I believe was my > > > > > post. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With that assumption, the above part of your notes > > > > > makes some very > > > > > > > > large assumptions that do not appear to be the case. > > > > > Yes, I can > > > > > > > > understand how they make a kind of ‘sense’ on first > > > > > glance; however, > > > > > > > > somehow you appear to assume that all of > > > > > consciousness/awareness > > > > > > > > involves thought and/or sense perception. I and others > > > > > do not find > > > > > > > > this to be the case. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On May 1, 8:45 am, RP <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just contemplate for a moment what comprises > > > > > consciousness. You are > > > > > > > > > conscious of sight, sound, scent, taste , your > > > > > body through sense of > > > > > > > > > feeling. In your mind you are aware of these very > > > > > things through your > > > > > > > > > memory of them. If your > > ... > > read more »- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text -
