" Value, I think, is a function of ego." Depends on which ego you are speaking of : Individuated or Cosmic ?
There are values we take on, if at all. And there are values that takes us, if ever. On Sat, Aug 28, 2010 at 6:23 PM, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > I am not sure where I gave you the idea that I thought there is only > one way to respond to experience, in fact, I sited two in the post of > responding to conflict, and referred to a host of other challenges. > We have, in any given moment, myriad responses possible. What I am > suggesting is that if I am perceiving opposition or conflict, I know I > am perceiving based on the limits of my ego, and so take the time (an > instant really) to recover those aspects of self - according to the > Banks model they would be Mind and Consciousness - to bring to the > moment in my response, allowing the non dual view of experience. > Here, I think, response is also formulated according to circumstance > of experience and state of being. But ultimately, any number of > possibilities can occur. > > This does not mean we disregard ego, rather, include all aspects with > it. Value, I think, is a function of ego. Just as important > (valuable) as any other aspect. > > I have my dark nights. All humans do. They are reconciled within me, > again, by including and sustaining all aspects of being in the > moment. They usually crop up when ego entertains any fear, keeping my > mind trapped in duality. I can remember my first as a teenager, it > lasted many months. Luckily, these days, they don't last long. > > On Aug 28, 4:20 am, ashok tewari <[email protected]> wrote: > > This is in continuity with Molly's post : > > > > " ... allows me to meet challenge in experience without conflict." > > > > Conflict, as in something that opposes, isn't it ? If yes, I see that as > > unavoidable, unless you are someone without any values of your own, which > > you feel committed to uphold within the space you call your own - mind, > > body, house, garden, family, friend, office, society, country, humanity, > > etc. > > > > Depending upon the value and severity of danger, one just has to deal > with > > it : oppose and fight physically or behaviourally, smile, pass by, run > away, > > or stoop to conquer ... there is an entire range. You seem to suggesting, > > actually recommending, that there is just one ... that serves you well. > > > > Conflict, as in yourself to yourself, is another matter. Even that is > > unavoidable, unless you are Buddha or thick as a brick ! Smiles are > hardly > > effective in this domain, ma'am. > > > > " If I find myself perceiving conflict, I know I am viewing my experience > > from the vantage point of ego (dual), and make the internal adjustments > to > > regain my integrity (include aspects of self excluded by the ego > viewpoint.) > > This can often be done and related to someone else without a word, more > of a > > smile with > > direct eye contact and expression of peace that immediately allows calm > to > > prevail. Words with a calm voice can also resolve more that thoughts or > > intellect." > > > > See above, and judge if you would still like to make these statements ! > > > > > > > > On Sat, Aug 28, 2010 at 1:43 AM, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > I was wondering, Molly, if you are responding to my post because I > > > mentioned the "wench" at the market and you inadvertently replied to > > > vam's or you did reply to vam's post. Either way vam seems to have > > > grasped my point and both agree on the individual efforting. I tossed > > > in a little lighthearted frivolity just to ease the seriousness of it; > > > some threads of late have been somber. > > > > > On Aug 27, 11:18 am, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > I think you have the point here, vam, that any change would be within > > > > us, how we experience mind, consciousness and thought. I would not > > > > presume to tell anyone in my daily experience how to conduct this > > > > within themselves unless it came up in conversation. But I do hold > > > > the Sydney Banks model up here as a pretty good one, on how I conduct > > > > myself in the moment to achieve clarity of experience. I like the > > > > simplicity of it. > > > > > > I don't encounter the wench at the store so all I can say is that I > > > > see my own direct experience as a reflection of the mind, > > > > consciousness and thought within me, and find it within myself to be > > > > fully present with each other. This allows me to meet challenge in > > > > experience without conflict. If I find myself perceiving conflict, I > > > > know I am viewing my experience from the vantage point of ego (dual), > > > > and make the internal adjustments to regain my integrity (include > > > > aspects of self excluded by the ego viewpoint.) This can often be > > > > done and related to someone else without a word, more of a smile with > > > > direct eye contact and expression of peace that immediately allows > > > > calm to prevail. Words with a calm voice can also resolve more that > > > > thoughts or intellect. > > > > > > That is not to say that I have not been called to reclaim my warrior > > > > aspect, rise to the current adversarial tone before toning the > > > > experience back to a peaceful one. But even this, for me, is done as > > > > an expression of the one as the only relation to other, eliminating > > > > any right or wrong in the situation. > > > > > > My life has taken may twists and turns that I would never have > > > > guessed. People I love get sick and die and have trouble and I feel > > > > it all with them, these are the challenges of being fully human. I > > > > accept all arms of Shiva the creator/destroyer, and that acceptance > > > > has become easier as I age in this life. > > > > > > On Aug 27, 12:54 am, ashok tewari <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > I'd go along with your skepticism, Slip, as being more desirable of > us > > > than > > > > > easy - to - dwell day - dreams that seem mere pollyannaish, and > perhaps > > > > > achieve nothing on the ground ! > > > > > > > What I do believe that a better hold on our emotions, emotions > charged > > > mind, > > > > > and the resulting emotions - led willfulness of the ego, would > > > certainly be > > > > > more self - empowering to us. The consequent sense of balance and > poise > > > > > would cause clearer thoughts, truer perspectives, rise of abiding > > > values > > > > > system and better critical thinking ability, and the skill to > choose > > > more > > > > > solutions - oriented behaviour all the time. > > > > > > > Anyone who does not have such hold on himself is not likely to have > a > > > > > peaceful mind and unhurried discriminating faculty, to contribute > much > > > good > > > > > to his environment. > > > > > > > On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 7:37 AM, Slip Disc <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > > > "If humans lived even a little more > > > > > > often in this last state of mind, the impact on world peace, from > a > > > > > > personal to a global level, would be significant" - MB > > > > > > > > I don't know that I could concur with such notion, many > throughout > > > > > > history have lived within enlightened states of mind and still > chaos > > > > > > ensued, maybe I need a little more elaboration on what you > consider > > > > > > the "state of mind"; is it like mind alternative, cj's cannabis, > om's > > > > > > delusion or gruff's world of reality?. Basically any peaceful > state > > > > > > of mind could lead to global peace when adopted by the entire > > > populous > > > > > > of planet earth but then there wouldn't be much left to free > thought > > > > > > and free will; we might as well be like animals that operate on > > > > > > instinct. > > > > > > Personally I don't think the idea is to waste any more time than > > > > > > necessary in this place because my notion is that there is > another > > > > > > place more suitable for those of peaceful demeanor; I guess that > is > > > > > > the core idea of heaven and hell. Trying to turn planet earth > into a > > > > > > peaceful utopia is like trying to separate the water from the > feces > > > in > > > > > > a septic tank with a fork. It is not about "here" and that is > why it > > > > > > goes "only the good die young" because they are ready to move on > to > > > > > > wherever; possibly to a parallel universe, another plane of > existence > > > > > > or remain in some pleasant dreamscape; it really doesn't matter > to me > > > > > > at all because, as you know, I'm just a voyeur and don't give a > damn > > > > > > if the whole place implodes. Hey, I'm not a real gynecologist but > I"m > > > > > > willing to take a look. ;-) > > > > > > > > "When humans understand that a thought is just a thought, just a > > > > > > creation from formless energy, the iron grip the ego can have on > us > > > > > > begins to lessen." - MB > > > > > > > > Very assumptive here Molly, creation from formless energy, iron > grip > > > > > > and lessening on the basis of simply understanding. > > > > > > We have yet to even scratch the surface of what thought is and > what > > > > > > can manifest from it. Perhaps life itself and all awareness is > > > > > > resultant of thought, whether from a collective human thought or > from > > > > > > some external, spiritual or supreme consciousness. Nothing is > > > > > > formless, everything can have some degree of form even if we are > > > > > > unaware of it's form. I've never seen any angels but I guess > they > > > > > > have some kind of form if you believe they exist. I've > experience > > > > > > apparitions of dead people and as you know within the dream realm > > > I've > > > > > > encountered numerous souls beyond this world. Again I have to say > > > that > > > > > > life is beyond "here", beyond what we know, what we see, what we > > > > > > experience and what we expect. > > > > > > > > "So, our personal answer is to share with people these simple > > > > > > principles that govern their states of mind. Because, beneath it > all, > > > > > > all humans are already wise, good, generous, kind and even > > > > > > enlightened." - MB > > > > > > > > Really? Do we just go out and tell people their state of mind is > > > > > > skewed? Do you know the wench that works at the market where I > shop? > > > > > > I would like you to share the simple principles her and hope you > > > don't > > > > > > get your nose bit off. I'm sure beneath it all she is wise, good > and > > > > > > generous but on top of the beneath the woman is totally beast. > > > > > > > > However, I have to give you credit for your dream fantasy > excursion. > > > > > > > > Now you do have some good points there Molly but don't we all > when it > > > > > > comes down to ............"If Only People Would..(blurb) life > would > > > be > > > > > > perfect. Basically that means............If there weren't so > many > > > > > > assholes in the world wouldn't it be a great place to live? > > > > > > > > You Betcha! > > > > > > > > I dare you to knock that off my shoulder (old commercial). Kiss > me > > > > > > first to lesson the shock. > > > > > > > > On Aug 26, 8:56 am, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > Mind: All human beings share in being a part of, and connected > to > > > > > > > Mind, the universal Life energy and source of intelligence > beyond > > > the > > > > > > > brain. Because of Mind, we share in an endless flow of > wisdom—each > > > of > > > > > > > us equally capable of being wise. > > > > > > > > > Consciousness: All human beings share in the principle or fact > of > > > > > > > Consciousness. We experience life. We also experience life from > > > > > > > different levels of consciousness—from truncated and > fear-based, > > > angry > > > > > > > and insecure “levels” to grounded, secure, safe, wise and even > > > > > > > enlightened states (Buddha Mind, Christ Consciousness, the > “Father > > > > > > > within,” the Kingdom of Heaven.) If humans lived even a little > more > > > > > > > often in this last state of mind, the impact on world peace, > from a > > > > > > > personal to a global level, would be significant. > > > > > > > > > The principle of Thought, as a universal function, guides > humans > > > > > > > either toward or away from non-violence, love and > > > > ... > > > > read more » -- ASHOK TEWARI
