Fine-tuning our judgement is part of education and growing up so we are less liable. It does depend on degree and the situation. I thought the Gulf War was bad judgement, for instance- I would have sent in Delta Force. Anyway, there are gulls all over the place, aren't there? Why do you think there are so many lawyers?
On Mar 13, 1:30 am, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > ....so one is to conclude that it is normal to have bad judgment? > > On Mar 12, 4:55 pm, [email protected] wrote: > > > > > It is not abnormal to have unrealistic expectation of oneself or of others. > > It is rather a matter of bad judgment. Abnormal in my opinion has to do > > with some evidence of pathology. It is a matter of degree. > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: ornamentalmind <[email protected]> > > To: "Minds Eye" <[email protected]> > > Sent: Sat, Mar 12, 2011 7:22 pm > > Subject: [Mind's Eye] Re: Ambivalence > > > How can one with 'unrealistic expectations' be considered 'normal'? > > > On Mar 12, 7:41 am, [email protected] wrote: > > > Ambivalence clinically (from the vantage point of a psychologist) > > > describes > > mixed feelings of love and hate directed to oneself and or > > > > important love objects. These feelings are normal - to disappointments > > > (often > > due to frustrated unrealistic expectations) of self to self or > > > > self and love object. > > > > Further - because of unconscious repression and or suppression the > > > 'negative' > > hateful feelings and fantasies are unrecognized and are > > > > often expressed in ways that are experienced as under or over reactions. > > > For > > example - a woman who has hostile feelings towards her > > > > husband but has a difficulty in allowing herself to accept them - may > > > often > > treat the husband with excessive deference, niceness, and > > > > subservience. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: rigsy03 <[email protected]> > > > To: "Minds Eye" <[email protected]> > > > Sent: Sat, Mar 12, 2011 9:59 am > > > Subject: [Mind's Eye] Re: Ambivalence > > > > I thought more about this topic. I gave a minor example regarding an > > > impending visit but ambilvalence can be more serious, I think. And > > > maybe I have used the wrong term to begin with! We were raised, for > > > instance, to ignore the incongruities in others and depended on > > > etiquette to get us through- we didn't often question the disconnect > > > but that began to change in the '70's with pop psychology and more > > > openess in relationships plus new terms and tools for labeling > > > behavior. > > > > Ambivalence may be a primitive warning sign, for instance, that > > > persons or events do not "add up", yet it resides initially in the sub > > > cs./emotions to begin with until it is able to be an intelligent > > > assessment. > > > > On Mar 10, 12:25 pm, "pol.science kid" <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > is ambivalence to be looked at in terms...or dissected of thesis, > > > > antithesis > > > > and synthesis..only...the anti thesis is as natural as thesis...not > > > > merely > > > > an artificial correction.... > > > > > On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 6:33 PM, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > Yikes! > > > > > > But Mardi and Gibbs have other ideas on the subject which suggest > > > > > ambivalence is quite normal. > > > > > > It depends on the choice/decision. I am quite at ease in making most > > > > > choices- informed, confident of my judgement and taste, etc. BUT... > > > > > > There are some areas that do indeed get muddied up sometimes and that > > > > > would often be relationships and the more intimate, the more > > > > > complicated. But it could also be another type of decision that has > > > > > consequences- a major purchase or committment to a career, etc. I am > > > > > not talking about the Pruefrock debate. > > > > > > Often there is a conflict between duty and expectation of one's > > > > > position and desire, feelings, etc. that are hestitant or in > > > > > opposition. In my case, I have agreed to a two week visit and I really > > > > > do not feel up to it. (Guilt?) Could it be the long, longer, longest > > > > > winter in memory? Is it putting away the knickknacks so the toddlers > > > > > won't break them? Is it that my routine and order will fly to the > > > > > winds? Or will the advent of spring- for surely it will arrive one of > > > > > these days- open windows, no boots, change the entire atmosphere? If > > > > > the past is a guide, it will be fun and lovely and I will grieve when > > > > > they depart. BUT... > > > > > > This child and I are very close yet have really gone through some > > > > > stuff together. I debated and she made reservations. :-) Am I still > > > > > remembering her as a teenager? > > > > > > Perhaps ambivalence comes into play when there is a good deal of > > > > > history/information and we get swarmed. So Mardi and Gibbs make good > > > > > points- go with your heart and accept the ambivalences. Afterall, it > > > > > is all all those differences that add spice to relationships, as well. > > > > > > But she can't have that ivory Buddha... :-) > > > > > > The instance when someone defined ambivalence was crucial and I > > > > > suppose part of a plan to help me assess facts versus wishes until I > > > > > finally had the courage to file for divorce. > > > > > > On Mar 10, 2:44 am, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > When felt as being problematic as rigsy does, ambivalence by > > > > > > definition is > > > > > > ‘pathological’.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ambivalence > > > > > > > The issue is not having been clarified enough to actually integrate > > > > > > apparently differing issues, values, notions etc. So, in this > > > > > > context, > > > > > > her feelings of distress point to an actual need for clarification. > > > > > > > There is a point where one can actually integrate all aspects of a > > > > > > situation/self. And, even though Wilber is more of a pop icon than a > > > > > > final embodiment of truth, he and his integralism is a good place to > > > > > > ‘start’ when it comes to this topic – ambivalence. > > > > > >http://integrallife.com/http://www.integralworld.net/augustine4.htmlh... > > > > > > > The topic, as simple as it is, can be made into a vast labyrinth of > > > > > > thought. > > > > > > > Molly on occasion addresses this too and in one of the above links > > > > > > philosophers are addressed including Plato. > > > > > > > As far as I’ve found, his “The Fifth” is about as far as one can go. > > > > > > > On Mar 9, 8:34 am, [email protected] wrote: > > > > > > > > Re ambivalence - It is not pathological but absolutely normal. > > > > > Love/hate exist in every relationship both with the self and the self > > > > > and > > > > > the self and others. If only we all were logical in the sense of > > scientific > > > > > cause and effect we could always be 'objective." But we human beings > > > > > are > > > > > much more complex than simply disembodied intellects. There is also > > > > > the > > > > > realm of mixed feelings. When you add linear (scientific causality) > > > > > logic > > > > > with the realm of messy feelings you get a hybrid causality I refer > > > > > to as > > > > > experiential logic (thinking plus mixed feelings and emotions). > > > > > Acknowledging this fact validate my wise psychoanalyst's insightful > > > > > observation: "In between black and white are not shades of gray; > > > > > rather, > > > > > there are colors. > > > > > > > > Gibbs Williams > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > > > From: rigsy03 <[email protected]> > > > > > > > To: "Minds Eye" <[email protected]> > > > > > > > Sent: Wed, Mar 9, 2011 8:46 am > > > > > > > Subject: [Mind's Eye] Re: Ambivalence > > > > > > > > I feel it in my mind and body and it can be very distressing- > > > > > > > back and > > > > > > > forth- this way and that- a maybe then no and all over again! :-) > > > > > > > > The brain/logic could have one arena and the > > > > > > > sub-conscious/emotions > > > > > > > have another. > > > > > > > > Sometimes I just don't decide and let whatever happens, happen- > > > > > > > i.e. I > > > > > > > tune out choice. This can be troublesome later if do not like the > > > > > > > outcome! :-) > > > > > > > > Someone once told me ambivalence is natural and normal and is a > > > > > > > way of > > > > > > > seeing things/relationships realistically. Perhaps that is true. > > > > > > > > On Mar 9, 6:20 am, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > The first step is 'seeing' (being aware of) it. > > > > > > > > > On Mar 9, 3:03 am, "pol.science kid" <[email protected]> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > i so get what you mean...... > > > > > > > > > > On Mar 8, 6:47 pm, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > How do you all/y'all handle this nettle?- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > > - Show quoted text - > > > > > -- > > > > \--/ Peace- Hide quoted text - > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text -
