I have real problems remembering where I left my glasses (though not the ones with beer in) - even the IMF are considering the old Chicago Plan (1936) for fairer money. We live as paupers in the land of plenty in my view.http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/wp/2012/ wp12202.pdf
It's long and boring, but the gist is in the short conclusion. It lacks your insight into what we are worshipping Al. On 22 Oct, 07:27, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > People are expected to change and grow. the errors of the past are > meant to be out grown and evolved into a life that is kinder and > gentler with others coming to the forefront leaving the self centered > being behind,, As I look around I am left wondering if this is what > is occurring,, I see wealth being more and more concentrated in the > greedy few.. I see the traditional higher power being replaced by a > god of gold and wealth, that is worshiped with immense intensity.. > an intensity that if applied to eliminating poverty ,, poverty would > be eliminated world wide within a few short years. > > I have not forgotten anything to my knowledge Neil I can remember my > childhood to date in great detail recall is not the problem and fear > well that is more to keep me from getting killed.. I tend to like > invisibility good idea > Allan > > > > > > > > On Sun, Oct 21, 2012 at 11:36 PM, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > With memories as bad as mine and yours Allan we have to invent for > > fear of remembering we have forgotten everything. > > > On 21 Oct, 19:00, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > >> What happens when your whole concepts begin changing.. strange > >> things like the entire universe becomes small and you have to go out > >> side its bounds.. Being a soul being what happens if the creation > >> soul is earlier than than the creation of the universe? > >> Allan > > >> On Sun, Oct 21, 2012 at 6:09 PM, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > Science doesn't fascinate me in the way some literature and people can > >> > generally - I suspect the 'enthusiasm' of the popularisation of the > >> > subjects. I concur on the predicament element rigs - insightive. It > >> > seems a mistake to me to try and place god in some scientific- > >> > dimensional space (though I miss Pat) and I wonder instead whether the > >> > god-positions people hack out are as baseless as, say, phlogiston - we > >> > need some new thinking. > > >> > Science and critical history have demonstrated much religious text is > >> > fable. We repeatedly see that image management hides much that is > >> > foul under 'preaching' - here our current examples would be Jimmy > >> > Saville, Baby P, priestly paedophiles and Hillsborough (scouting in > >> > the US etc.) - but I'd say we may be on the brink of realising > >> > economics is equally vile. > > >> > I can imagine spending a few weeks with a group living human- > >> > constrained lives in a collective of the future. A woman kisses me > >> > goodbye. She will not see me again because I'm off to a near-space > >> > terminal built off Alpha Proxima. From there I'm relativity > >> > travelling to the edge of this universe to undertake genetic > >> > transformation beyond the gene-splicing that has allowed me to travel > >> > in space. I see in 16 colours thanks to a shrimp and can enter > >> > cryostasis thanks to genes from Arctic fish. I interface with > >> > machines and their learning directly. I can no longer replicate as a > >> > human - etc. Now I'm off to meet and form a collective with beings > >> > who perceive much of the world we can only postulate. In traditional > >> > science fiction these 'dark beings' would be bastards intent on taking > >> > over the human world. What I don't see is any focus on a future in > >> > which the rather soppy human-emotional ties are broken - a future in > >> > which ... > > >> > One might ask how the creature I have become would get his jollies. > >> > One can go the other way in history and ask what religion has actually > >> > done. We are not inventive enough about god. > > >> > On 21 Oct, 14:50, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> And some feel science is boring unless it can be translated into > >> >> everyday life in meaningful ways. > > >> >> On Oct 20, 3:50 pm, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> >> > We travel at 60k plus miles an hour in the solar system and 500K > >> >> > through the galaxy in our system. I tend to believe we can measure > >> >> > this kind of thing and that we are always left with questions like > >> >> > Allan's about before after and beyond. Hitch-hikers' Guide probably > >> >> > gets to the irony. Quite a few of us discount priests and text- > >> >> > authority without giving up on spirit. Spinoza remains the clearest > >> >> > example. > > >> >> > Creation stories end up in infinite regress - scientific and otherwise > >> >> > - and beg the question of 'what came before that' by positing a > >> >> > fiction of something that needs no creator or origin. I don't believe > >> >> > god whipped up the Grand Canyon, but in the limits of our thinking > >> >> > something whipped up something that led to the evolution of our planet > >> >> > etc. I tend to think science rather than literature may lead to a > >> >> > different way of seeing this and surviving until this is possible. > >> >> > Literature is generally bland and lacks depth - though there are great > >> >> > moments. I suspect one of the key issues is raised by Gabby a lot of > >> >> > the time - we need to replace current authority and know the irony is > >> >> > such attempts just produce the same old business as usual (WB Yeates > >> >> > was good on this). > > >> >> > The stuff on thermodynamics above is very similar in method to > >> >> > Einstein and what we might now term Wittgensteinian deconstruction - > >> >> > trying to find the common elements and mistakes in various competing > >> >> > arguments and readdress the apparent conflict. Molly has some words > >> >> > on this too. > > >> >> > On 20 Oct, 20:37, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> >> > > google books had a copy up online, it may still be there. Used book > >> >> > > outlets like Alibris will allow you to put in the book you are > >> >> > > searching > >> >> > > for and notify you when a copy becomes available for sale by a > >> >> > > store that > >> >> > > uses their service. Other than that, you may find some good > >> >> > > articles about > >> >> > > it with excerpts online. for Einstein fans, it is a favorite. > > >> >> > > On Saturday, October 20, 2012 10:14:03 AM UTC-4, Allan Heretic > >> >> > > wrote: > > >> >> > > > how does a person get a hold of the original text..?? > >> >> > > > Allan > > >> >> > > > On Sat, Oct 20, 2012 at 3:10 PM, Molly <[email protected] > >> >> > > > <javascript:>>wrote: > > >> >> > > >> The Einstein "The World As I See It," originally began as his > >> >> > > >> ponderance > >> >> > > >> of something greater than science, and acknowledgement of spirit > >> >> > > >> in action. > >> >> > > >> The original edition is the best, as his editors put together > >> >> > > >> texts with > >> >> > > >> lectures for him under the same name, and those books have an > >> >> > > >> entirely > >> >> > > >> different flavor. > > >> >> > > >> From my view, "knowing" is not the end of it, but the beginning. > > >> >> > > >> On Saturday, October 20, 2012 8:09:19 AM UTC-4, gabbydott wrote: > > >> >> > > >>> Honestly, Vam, I don't think that it was Einstein's lack of > >> >> > > >>> knowledge > >> >> > > >>> that made him pose such a daft (in the sense of limited) > >> >> > > >>> question. I read > >> >> > > >>> this as a description of the state of occidental science at his > >> >> > > >>> time - the > >> >> > > >>> conflict between the ontological and the constructivist > >> >> > > >>> explanatory models > >> >> > > >>> of the nature of knowledge. > > >> >> > > >>> On Sat, Oct 20, 2012 at 8:41 AM, Vam <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> >> > > >>>> You spoke of Einstein, about his ” only ” interest being > >> >> > > >>>> whether God<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God> had > >> >> > > >>>> any choice in manifesting the universe and this observed > >> >> > > >>>> creation. > > >> >> > > >>>> My own suggestion is that if we do not know enough we will > >> >> > > >>>> always think > >> >> > > >>>> along those lines. > > >> >> > > >>>> To the uninitiate, the desktops of today would seem to be > >> >> > > >>>> thinking > >> >> > > >>>> entities ... > > >> >> > > >>>> *So, do we know enough ?* > > >> >> > > >>>> <https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-EBJSz8MhWQU/UIJGzwpvR3I/AAAAAAAAB0...> > > >> >> > > >>>> On Saturday, October 20, 2012 6:36:45 AM UTC+5:30, rigsy03 > >> >> > > >>>> wrote: > > >> >> > > >>>>> I took a course on the Snow-Leavis(1959-1962) controversy in > >> >> > > >>>>> the > >> >> > > >>>>> mid-'70's. Perhaps we should then conclude scientists do not > >> >> > > >>>>> understand humanism? Other works involved included various > >> >> > > >>>>> essays and > >> >> > > >>>>> books by Aldous Huxley ("Literature and Science") and > >> >> > > >>>>> Bronowski > >> >> > > >>>>> ("Science and Human Values"). Not sure that "incomprehension > >> >> > > >>>>> and > >> >> > > >>>>> dislike"(Snow) between the two groups has changed at all when > >> >> > > >>>>> considering the gap between rich and poor nations, smart > >> >> > > >>>>> weapons, etc. > >> >> > > >>>>> as science and militarism promote the self-interest of various > >> >> > > >>>>> nations/ > >> >> > > >>>>> political theories and practices. Should we quibble that Nazi > >> >> > > >>>>> scientists propelled the USA moon landing? At least the moon > >> >> > > >>>>> survived. > > >> >> > > >>>>> On Oct 19, 1:37 pm, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> > > >>>>> > The below is rather long, but physics is returning to some > >> >> > > >>>>> > of the > >> >> > > >>>>> > ideas of James Maxwell. My dog is named after him. Years > >> >> > > >>>>> > ago, we > >> >> > > >>>>> > were told their were two cultures ( CP Snow) - one knew the > >> >> > > >>>>> > 2nd law > >> >> > > >>>>> of > >> >> > > >>>>> > thermodynamics and the other did not (literary types). The > >> >> > > >>>>> > 2nd law > >> >> > > >>>>> > involved was a straw man. The following, as Max needs his > >> >> > > >>>>> > walk, is > >> >> > > >>>>> > paraphrased from last week's New Scientist. > > >> >> > > >>>>> > A few decades after Carnot, the German physicist Rudolph > >> >> > > >>>>> > Clausius > >> >> > > >>>>> > explained such phenomena in terms of a quantity > >> >> > > >>>>> > characterising > >> >> > > >>>>> > disorder that he called entropy. In this picture, the > >> >> > > >>>>> > universe works > >> >> > > >>>>> > on the back of processes that increase entropy - for example > >> >> > > >>>>> > dissipating heat from places where it is concentrated, and > >> >> > > >>>>> > therefore > >> >> > > >>>>> > more ordered, to cooler areas, where it is not. That > >> >> > > >>>>> > predicts a > > ... > > read more » --
