divine right = selfishness and greed often a justification for stealing and enslaving..
Economy is for taking care of all the people not just the select few.. and the Scottish are a distant branch of German as are the English and Irish.. Every one finds the truth eventually most later than sooner. On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 2:30 PM, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > I like the divine right analogy rigs. I don't favour capitalism for > much the same reason. Much discussion of right and wrong is stuck in > a past we need to escape. Origin is difficult. Born a Scot I might > revere our heritage - but 3000 years ago 'we' were likely German > farmers eating 'grass porridge'. Capitalism broke up much of > feudalism, but I suspect it was no more than a revision of Domesday > Book accounting and labour exploitation. Much of what actually goes > on is not capitalism but the establishment of rents through financial > manipulations - essentially a control fraud by the rentier-class. > We've been had on a butty - and need more modern argument based on > what we know, facts shared in a common language. > There is a literature suggesting our environmental knowledge is now > important in moral decision-making I think we have missed a lot > before this. Current technology is good enough for us to create self- > sustaining communities and give up on empire. We need to re-evaluate > our morality against this. I don't see this leading to socialism and > any aim seems to me to be about considerably more freedom - from such > things as war, work ethics formed in times of shortage and need for > hard labour and so on. The Soviet empire was much like the Tsars it > replaced - we used to call the KGB 'Checkists' after the Tsar's secret > police. > I suspect capitalism - unless used as a pejorative - is little more > than an accounting system. The problem lies in its corruption. > People cheat and cheats like crimogenic systems that allow work in the > dark. The umpire in cricket is now redundant - machines are better. > We could have had a machine accounting system on a global basis by now > - instead machines play a bigger role in cheating. Capitalism with > fair accounting presents few problems except for losers in the > competition. In sport we have competitions that allow losers first > draft picks and our course there is no competition if one eradicates > the competition. Wigan's dominance of the Rugby League was truly > horrible - it was hard t turn up to watch knowing every other team > would lose. > The pathway to Hell is lined with good intentions Gabby - we are > scared of change. Does anyone now believe that rule by the Guardians > of future socialist paradise can be established to wither away? Or > that the rentiers will wither away as Keynes hoped? And are such > matters not the same coin, merely opposite sides? Capitalism has run > up a lot of debt - are we so sure of it we can do away with time- > honoured debt jubilee? Would it not make more sense to give away what > we have built already to the people, have something of a leveling and > start again with a new focus on sustainability? > The genuine capitalist firm treats finance as a cost - it is difficult > to see from this how the vast transactions of financial services are > not parasitic on such firms and all of us. The bubbles created cause > much misery and form part of a vast Ponzi scheme we have no need of. > Beyond this, capitalism is really assumed to be a dirty game of beggar > thy neighbour we are ahead in and need to stay ahead in or we'll lose > military edge (and so on). We end up justifying doing bad things for > the greater end and rationalising this as moral. > > On Jan 31, 9:14 am, gabbydott <[email protected]> wrote: >> The way you contrast socialism and capitalism is like contrasting >> creationism versus evolutionism. And by the natural law that the fittest >> will survive you are right to have decided for the evolutionary view. >> >> I don't think - and the exchange in this group has helped me a lot to see >> this clearer - we should forget how tempting the search for the right >> answers is. >> >> 2013/1/31 rigs <[email protected]> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > I am a fan of capitalism. I consider Marxism and Fascism as an >> > extension of socialism which is an extension of divine rights,etc., >> > i.e. theft, redistribution of another's wealth and labor, weakening of >> > the body politic (a form of serfdom) which turns governments into >> > bloodsuckers via taxes and debt.//Do you think economics is a valid >> > science? Why, when it has flopped so many times.//We need production >> > and labor plus consumption so there is a need for immigrants into >> > white industrial countries to make up for the decline of white births >> > (55 million abortions plus birth control). But I wonder if illegals >> > will pay back taxes and bother to learn English. It might go smoother >> > if we learn Spanish and Europe learn Arabic.//Family can also hurt >> > people but sometimes that hurt teaches valuable lessons. It is easier >> > to leave some people and events to Heaven though it would probably >> > spell the end of the legal profession. >> >> > On Jan 30, 4:56 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: >> > > I'm not sure the audience is as wide as your estimate rigs. >> > > Technically I am hospitable to any theoretical view from marxism to >> > > fascism - though I tend to dislike theoretical views - and hospitable >> > > to Islamic theory/s in business analysis - and to guests in my >> > > classrooms from all backgrounds. This is easy enough - as easy as >> > > offering to put you up if you were travelling in the UK. The >> > > difficult bit is in reciprocity - here we might think of the Maussian >> > > concept of the gift and many examples in 'stoneage economics' - what >> > > is expect of a guest in return. One gives freely - a few nights stay >> > > is not given for a return of a few nights stay and so on - yet one >> > > does not generally keep giving to inhospitable guests. One can >> > > discuss racism yet not tolerate racists - but to brand people >> > > concerned their opportunities for homes and work are disappearing in >> > > immigration flows as racist who raise these issues with some hatred on >> > > the people taking them is also wrong (particularly if done by >> > > politically correct idiots whose homes and jobs are not under such >> > > threat). Hospitality is sometimes easy, sometimes very hard work, can >> > > be a treat or pain - but is always already reciprocal in intent even >> > > if no commodity exchange is meant. I prefer to be hospitable to you >> > > rigs than tolerant - tolerance has pratronising aspects - and this is >> > > my general approach to things intellectual. It's easy with you as I >> > > like what I hear. I have lost hospitality to politics. Left to typo >> > > as it hits the meaning better than the word I intended! >> >> > > People hurt us Andrew. We hurt them. Some is intentional some not. >> > > Gossip is often vicious from the pub to academic cloister. >> > > Transactional analysis isn't a bad place to look at how rigs' >> > > "balanced score card" builds up in personal relationships - Eric >> > > Berne's 'Games People Play' is still. the best book. Only friends can >> > > generally hurt us as we come to expect better from them, value them >> > > and so on. Friendship is easily mimicked and sometimes that small >> > > thing you mention may reveal the charade. Sometimes we take things >> > > too hard and should just let an incident wash away. This can be >> > > particularly hard if you've been collecting brown stamps (been shit >> > > on) in too many recent encounters. I used to go to the pub every >> > > Friday to get rid of my collection - but this habit itself became a >> > > brown stamp. I'm not religious but there's lots in forgiveness and >> > > 'there but for the grace of god go I'. >> >> > > On 29 Jan, 19:11, rigs <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > > > Please define what you mean by "hospitality"- of the individual, the >> > > > group, nations. Thanks. :-) >> >> > > > On Jan 29, 5:22 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > > > > I think the first consideration is hospitality rigs. >> >> > > > > On Jan 29, 12:10 am, rigs <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > > > > > At least some had good intentions re empires- maybe that should be >> > > > > > noted. And I believe in good intentions, myself- don't you? It's >> > > > > > likely a project for those two columCouldns of thinking and >> > sorting. >> >> > > > > > On Jan 28, 6:41 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > > > > > > Good question Andrew - though we could wonder why most people >> > have >> > > > > > > rosy views of the US and British empires, pretty much against >> > the real >> > > > > > > history. >> >> > > > > > > On Jan 28, 11:19 am, rigs <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > > > > > > > Try being Pollyanna for a day and see how far you get. Or Dr. >> > Pangloss >> > > > > > > > ("Candide") >> >> > > > > > > > On Jan 28, 5:11 am, andrew vecsey <[email protected]> >> > wrote: >> >> > > > > > > > > Why do so many of us remember negative feelings easier than >> > positive ones. >> > > > > > > > > Pain over pleasure. Bad news over good news. Why does "bad" >> > overshadow >> > > > > > > > > "good", immorality over morality, despair over hope, >> > pessimism over >> > > > > > > > > optimism. Why does hate appear to be more powerful than >> > love? Why is greed >> > > > > > > > > louder than generosity. Why is destruction of war so much >> > faster than the >> > > > > > > > > building power of peace. Why can one little lie destroy a >> > lifetime of >> > > > > > > > > trust. Why are lies more influential than truth. It all >> > seems so one sided. >> > > > > > > > > Why is that?- Hide quoted text - >> >> > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - >> >> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - >> >> > > - Show quoted text - >> >> > -- >> >> > --- >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> > ""Minds Eye"" group. >> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> > email to [email protected]. >> > For more options, visithttps://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > -- > > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > ""Minds Eye"" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > -- ( ) |_D Allan Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living. Of course I talk to myself, Sometimes I need expert advice.. -- --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
