>From what I have seen there are far to many posers. Many writing books and >still have no real idea of what is happening. I know a bit but nothing compared to my native american friends. Often times they see what I can not one of them jokingly called me a blind eagle.. I was put into the position i desperately needed to use what i knew to help keep my ex alive and get her through serious medical conditions. . Mostly helping her deal with pain and avoid some of the effects of major brain surgery. The surgeon and I talked for hours and liked the results.. we became good friends. We were able to avoid excessive use of drugs. Which was good for her recovery. . It had many strange effects. . One of them is she hated me for keeping her alive.. I don't mind helping someone but I have no desire to control anyone.. fortunately people do not pay attention because there is a lot of natural spiritual energy involved and they never really learn to guide it.. good thing actually because there are places it is better not to tread. For me it was fascinating journey it verified what I was told. To journey with a true shaman can be an fantastic experience. But only if they want to take you. I was fortunate because i did voluntary work in their close proximity and we liked each other.. they bailed me out with the bishop when I stepped out of his guidelines. They where a group if characters what surprised me when around me there was an amazing was the inter tribal cooperation .. because thety told me how they did the samething. And of course they were all right.. but it was fascinating. . Even for them i think.. sometimes they knew each other from different planes.
تجنب. القتل والاغتصاب واستعباد الآخرين Avoid; murder, rape and enslavement of others -----Original Message----- From: Molly <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Wed, 22 Apr 2015 12:50 PM Subject: Re: Mind's Eye Re: Time There is no fear or danger in the shaman's journey, although the people that they help or "journey with" may be filled with fear, and so feel danger. Ultimately, during a journey into the soul, you can only be afraid of yourself. Although, like a bad acid trip, unstable personalities can unravel. Poser shamans might take advantage of others to claim "power" over them, but they aren't doing the authentic work of the shaman which is providing guidance for an inward journey and nothing more. On Monday, April 20, 2015 at 8:02:47 PM UTC-4, archytas wrote: > > I meant to respond to this earlier. Headaches stole the day! I've been > reading work by a Yanomami shaman: > But the white people are other than us…. Their thought remains constantly > attached > to their merchandise. They make it relentlessly and constantly desire new > goods. But > they are probably not as wise as they think they are. I fear that this > euphoria of > merchandise will have no end and that they will entangle themselves with > it to the > point of chaos. They are already constantly killing each other for money > in their > cities and fighting other people for minerals and oil they take from the > ground. But > they do not seem concerned that they are making us all perish with the > epidemic > fumes that escape from all these things. They do not think that they are > spoiling the > earth and the sky and that they will never be able to recreate new ones > (p.281). > > The Falling Sky: Words of a Yanomami Shaman > Kopenawa, Davi, and Bruce Albert. > Cambridge, MA: Belknap Press of Harvard University Press. 2013. > > There's a free review here if anyone is interested - > http://digitalcommons.trinity.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1193&context=tipiti > > “There is only one sky and we must > take care of it, for if it becomes sick, everything will come to an end” > (p. 410). > “I often listen to the words of my spirits who angrily ask themselves: > Why are the white people so hostile to us? > Why do they want us to die? What do they have against us who do not > mistreat them? Is it > simply because we are other people, inhabitants of the forest?” (p. 408). > > Some guy born in the rain forest varies in semantics yet knows much the > same as us. I'm not keen on the supernatural as I tend to think freedom is > being free of arbitrary power decisions - so listening to one's soul is > cute a metaphor, but also very dangerous for me - and falling out over > words that are so ambiguous in the first place. > > > On Sunday, April 19, 2015 at 5:26:51 PM UTC+1, Molly wrote: >> >> No doubt we confuse our terms and semantic levels of meaning. I don't >> think any of that changes the mechanisms of thought, feeling and physical >> function in our lives. It only changes our view of our lives, that includes >> our beliefs, concepts, philosophies, systems including health, political >> and economic. Propaganda is nourished in the confusion. >> >> On Sunday, April 19, 2015 at 12:09:59 PM UTC-4, archytas wrote: >>> >>> Intellectual traditions tend to assume human powers in reason exist to >>> restrain our baser instincts. This is largely an assumption about the >>> classical soul, copied into Xtianity and Islam. We all have animalistic >>> drives and passions, and Reason constrains these individually and as a >>> polis (polis is the root of both polite and police). This Reason is a moral >>> force. Lingering in this is a notion that our powers of creativity must be >>> demonic. Hume, perhaps infamously, had it that 'reason is and ought only >>> to be the slave of the passions'. Reason cannot tell us what we should >>> want, only how to get it. I am by no means sure of this argument, which I >>> think conflates reason and deduction-induction-abduction. I am convinced >>> we have bureaucratised reason as a way of concealing passion and spirit. >>> >>> Our conception of rationality is incoherent, hardly a good start for any >>> rational claims. Sometimes rationality is a means, sometimes it's an end; >>> othertimes it has nothing to do with morality ('value-free') and then it is >>> the essence of what is right and good. Princeton, at one time, ran a >>> course in "value free ethics", particularly stupid given that science knows >>> no such thing as pure thought and knows any human without emotion would be >>> incapable of thought. >>> >>> A long way back in time, we find Molly's spiritual and mystical >>> techniques for achieving union with the divine as rationality. Our fellow >>> travellers would be Greeks living in Italy - the Pythagoreans. In out time >>> we have come to identify the soul, not with Reason but with everything that >>> makes us unique, idiosyncratic or imaginative as pathetic romanticists in >>> love with cosmological bureaucracy. >>> >>> On Sunday, April 19, 2015 at 2:04:09 PM UTC+1, archytas wrote: >>>> >>>> Clarity is a strange business. The language of being clear, resembling >>>> being bleached or de-loused in Scientology, dominates much of social >>>> research in needing to be pre-suppositionless, not to contaminate the >>>> research situation and hundreds of other terms such as 'hermeneutics >>>> guarantees truth'. This is all to be done by 'objects' that carry more >>>> other organisms around with them than cells with their own DNA. >>>> >>>> Screws change directions on boats. This may be what saves the boat >>>> from ending-up on the rocks. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Sunday, April 19, 2015 at 1:14:04 PM UTC+1, Allan Heretic wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Okay no soul just the eternal mind. . >>>>> Sorry I screwed things up for you >>>>> Neil what was this beginning of clarity? >>>>> >>>>> تجنب. القتل والاغتصاب واستعباد الآخرين >>>>> Avoid; murder, rape and enslavement of others >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: archytas <[email protected]> >>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>> Sent: Sun, 19 Apr 2015 2:08 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: Mind's Eye Re: Time >>>>> >>>>> I'm not suggesting any of us are Scientologists in any direct sense. >>>>> Though when we talk of rationality, clarity and other impossible >>>>> ideal-types forgetting they are ideals, we share something with such >>>>> lunacy. Of course, it isn't long before Allan screws up any chance of >>>>> clarity, saving ourselves from ourselves with his up-the-sleeve soul >>>>> forever-undefined-curing-all. >>>>> >>>>> I rather liked the idea that whatever we did was accessible to other >>>>> people, whatever 'condition' they were in. >>>>> >>>>> On Sunday, April 19, 2015 at 12:12:41 PM UTC+1, Molly wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> I suppose that's where the "father, forgive them for they know not >>>>>> what they do" advise comes in Neil. Even with people motivated by >>>>>> criminal >>>>>> intent, they don't really understand the magnificence of the life >>>>>> they've >>>>>> been given and how they squander it. I grew weary of letting the ills of >>>>>> humanity upset me log ago and have mostly let go of it, although >>>>>> occasionally fall back into dismay over it. That dismay interferes with >>>>>> my >>>>>> reverent feelings for life's wonders, so, eventually, I can again see >>>>>> the >>>>>> wisdom in letting go. >>>>>> >>>>>> And even though, when in the throes of a virus, it is hard to >>>>>> remember the wonder, I do manage to find it every day. Even in a post >>>>>> that >>>>>> says "human society has little in it I would choose," because it allows >>>>>> me >>>>>> a kindred spirit. There is more to life than what human society holds >>>>>> and >>>>>> although at times it is difficult to see deeper or beyond, once done, it >>>>>> also seems so simple to do. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Sunday, April 19, 2015 at 3:30:16 AM UTC-4, Allan Heretic wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Time is still a question.. but i do see an interconnection.. and >>>>>>> also Molly's friends.. RP sent me an email saying he wants back in. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I have friends who were involved with scientology. . They do a lot >>>>>>> of brain washing. And bad creating lots of problems .. from what the >>>>>>> movie >>>>>>> was saying is time is a perspective .. it seems to be a series of >>>>>>> markers >>>>>>> of the past ~ present . >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The present moment is elusive as as as soon as you read this it is >>>>>>> already past.. as for the soul how does time interconnect with >>>>>>> economics? >>>>>>> That is your speciality. . I always thought that when you look at from >>>>>>> different perspectives (booooo!) it helps in expanding and enlighting >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> concepts escaping from the lectures. . >>>>>>> The effect if time on present day economic practice.. perfect for >>>>>>> perspective time snapshots.. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> lol. Where is the new camp ground? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> تجنب. القتل والاغتصاب واستعباد الآخرين >>>>>>> Avoid; murder, rape and enslavement of others >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: archytas <[email protected]> >>>>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>>>> Sent: Sun, 19 Apr 2015 4:06 AM >>>>>>> Subject: Re: Mind's Eye Re: Time >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Allan's brief mention of time, before scuttling back into his >>>>>>> soul-shell, might have something in it. There is only so much time one >>>>>>> can >>>>>>> lend to various ventures. I have developed an interest in the more >>>>>>> honest >>>>>>> creatures of this earth and find it easy to put time in there. I have >>>>>>> been >>>>>>> led (I hope led) to a view that human society is severely disabled and >>>>>>> has >>>>>>> little in it I would choose. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> "Scientology" is both a criminal organisation (an interesting in >>>>>>> that we struggle to treat it as such) and a glaring example of wider, >>>>>>> crude >>>>>>> religious practices everywhere. I fancy what most people have assumed >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> be rationality over the years is, in fact, something similarly crude >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> more of medieval time than anything modern. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We should upsticks Molly. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Sunday, April 19, 2015 at 12:13:45 AM UTC+1, Molly wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Scientology is one of those deadly Kool Aid cults with an enormous >>>>>>>> amount of money behind the effort. It took a small bit of Hermetic >>>>>>>> philosophy, as old as written history, added methods of control and >>>>>>>> brainwashing, threw in shunning and voila, you have something worth >>>>>>>> grabbing your children and your assets and running at least a thousand >>>>>>>> miles to get away from (Katie Holmes. >>>>>>>> Having its roots in Hermetic philosophy legitimizes it to its >>>>>>>> constituents because these same concepts have been echoed throughout >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> ages. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Not sure where you stand on the concept of soul, Neil. My biggest >>>>>>>> worry for this group is that it is wobbling on a failing platform that >>>>>>>> leaves it open to wackos and trolls. this makes it hard for a small >>>>>>>> group >>>>>>>> dialogue to survive. Maybe it is too boring without a bundle of alters >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> one deeply disturbed person constantly arguing with themselves. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Saturday, April 18, 2015 at 4:07:54 PM UTC-4, archytas wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> It's not really surprising time in this group has been so >>>>>>>>> medieval. Rationality has been conflated with morality, thinking >>>>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>> spirituality (very Descartes) and legitimation with the supernatural. >>>>>>>>> Some >>>>>>>>> of the action hasn't been that distanced from Scientology. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Saturday, April 18, 2015 at 4:29:21 PM UTC+1, Allan Heretic >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Love always creats a special bond between souls.. you an I both >>>>>>>>>> know souls are eternal she is doing what she needs. All I can say is >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>> her to follow her soul.. the soul can find the path if given a >>>>>>>>>> chance. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> تجنب. القتل والاغتصاب واستعباد الآخرين >>>>>>>>>> Avoid; murder, rape and enslavement of others >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>> From: Molly <[email protected]> >>>>>>>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sat, 18 Apr 2015 4:54 PM >>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: Mind's Eye Re: Time >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I have a dear friend whose husband languishes in the hospital >>>>>>>>>> right now in his last days on earth. She holds his hand and wonders, >>>>>>>>>> as we >>>>>>>>>> all do during times like these, about the "time" we are given in >>>>>>>>>> this life >>>>>>>>>> with those we love. Sometimes, it seems to be cut too short and I >>>>>>>>>> have to >>>>>>>>>> wonder if this isn't the workings of soul, as we are connected there >>>>>>>>>> eternally to those we love most. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Friday, April 17, 2015 at 6:32:05 PM UTC-4, Allan Heretic >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Love watching the sun rise.. sailing creates strange >>>>>>>>>>> perspectives. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> تجنب. القتل والاغتصاب واستعباد الآخرين >>>>>>>>>>> Avoid; murder, rape and enslavement of others >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>>> From: Molly <[email protected]> >>>>>>>>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sat, 18 Apr 2015 12:15 AM >>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: Mind's Eye Re: Time >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> When I stop watching the clock, sunrise and sunset still give a >>>>>>>>>>> pace of time to my day. The seasons give a broader pace. We age in >>>>>>>>>>> time. We >>>>>>>>>>> measure change with time. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, April 17, 2015 at 2:35:15 PM UTC-4, Allan Heretic >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Back in my younger days the book that gave the value of cars >>>>>>>>>>>> was actually blue. Hence the name.. >>>>>>>>>>>> See Tony even I can take leaps forward into reality.. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> lol. (",) >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> تجنب. القتل والاغتصاب واستعباد الآخرين >>>>>>>>>>>> Avoid; murder, rape and enslavement of others >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>>>> From: archytas <[email protected]> >>>>>>>>>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Fri, 17 Apr 2015 8:25 PM >>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: Mind's Eye Re: Time >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Sounds really deep Tony - maybe we should leave it buried? >>>>>>>>>>>> Reality has taken a leap forward with Allan recognising a book >>>>>>>>>>>> plug as a >>>>>>>>>>>> book plug. Soon he will be able to tell us a blue book is blue >>>>>>>>>>>> (which it >>>>>>>>>>>> isn't). We don't know there is a reality. There is a reality >>>>>>>>>>>> hypothesis. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Get real people! >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, April 17, 2015 at 5:33:19 PM UTC+1, facilitator >>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Time is an abstraction, a non quantifiable human invention >>>>>>>>>>>>> used for measurement. Said more simply, it is not the substance >>>>>>>>>>>>> but the >>>>>>>>>>>>> flask. Outside of human conjecture time does not exist. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, April 17, 2015 at 12:25:25 PM UTC-4, Allan Heretic >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I did watch the movie. Interesting reminded me of a book >>>>>>>>>>>>>> promotion. . And we actually have heard the same logic from RP >>>>>>>>>>>>>> using a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hindu God.. did not agree with that argument either. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> In the end there was a promotion for his book. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> He gets into a lot of Einstein concepts on time.. listening >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to him and the other program. Time is evasive and a matter of >>>>>>>>>>>>>> perspective. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> A perspective unique to each person. . The one thing apparently >>>>>>>>>>>>>> physics >>>>>>>>>>>>>> can not prove is the exsistance if time. . Unlike the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> conclusions people >>>>>>>>>>>>>> these people want to jump to.. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> It would seem to me that all our souls are responsible for >>>>>>>>>>>>>> is the perspective known by the unique soul inside the reality >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of non-time >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ¿known? to exist within the reality of time.. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Which gets back to the original question just what the heck >>>>>>>>>>>>>> is time? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> تجنب. القتل والاغتصاب واستعباد الآخرين >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Avoid; murder, rape and enslavement of others >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Molly <[email protected]> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thu, 16 Apr 2015 10:47 PM >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Mind's Eye Re: Time >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> This was in my mailbox (interestingly enough) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://youtu.be/H1WfFkp4puw <https://youtu.be/H1WfFkp4puw> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thursday, April 16, 2015 at 4:03:34 PM UTC-4, Allan >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Heretic wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Just what the heck is time. I always thouhght of it as a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> constant.. only to find it is a veriable .. unlike other >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> veriables.. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Just what the heck is ¿Time? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> تجنب. القتل والاغتصاب واستعباد الآخرين >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Avoid; murder, rape and enslavement of others >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from >>>>>>>>>>>>>> it, send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>>>> Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. >>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from >>>>>>>>>>>> it, send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>>> Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from >>>>>>>>>>> it, send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>> Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> --- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> --- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>> >>>> -- --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. 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