OK Danny, I will digress a bit, my 931 uses CIS also, but that is in a forced-induction situation. In boosted applications CIS is OK but it still is forced to grossly over-fuel the engine to keep the temps down and to keep the enrichment correct. YMMV, but I still feel CIS is a weak link in the intake system. I drove a 1.8L RD motor in a Scirocco with CIS, then we swapped the exact same engine into a Digifant car, and the Digifant injection made the same engine rev much much quicker. True, Digifant also has a restriction. As far as Miller FI goes, I was un-impressed with his set-ups, when he used to do CIS swaps on 914's, they were crudely executed. Perhaps things have changed now. I am pretty sure we will get to see a carbbed 2.0L 16V pretty soon, as Ratlow expressed an interest in carbbing his 2.0L. Perhaps I will sell him mine and step up to TEC-II. Thanks man for the response, I thought maybe you were dead ;)
Jay ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]>; <[email protected]> Cc: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2001 12:45 PM Subject: Re: CIS-E vs. Motronic with modded 2.0l's > Jay, You bring up some good points , but a properly set-up CIS will make as > much (or more) hp as carbs plus have the added advantage of driveability and > adaptability. > > The term "Motronic" can be applied equally well to both continuous and pulsed > Bosch EFI systems-- as long as they integrate ignition as well as fuel > management. > > Evidently, Porsche doesn't agree with the statement "CIS = Cant Induce > Speed", as they were one of the LAST manufacturers to convert to pulsed fuel > injection. I think the 930 was quick enough to prove CIS in a performance > application. > > I visited Miller Fuel Injection earlier this week, and checked out a custom > CIS setup derived from a Porsche 928. It utilizes a variable plenum and > individual TBs downstream of the flow plate. He is getting well upwards of > 220 hp out of 2 liter aircooled motors with that system. He also custom > machines airflow bowls and reworks fuel distributors that support upwards of > 200 hp from CIS basic. > > Here's a link to Miller FI : > > http://millerfi.com/ > > It's funny that you would bring up those dyno charts, Clay--as of this week, > they are outdated for Bretts car. (it's even better now) > > Being that Brett is one of the "pioneers" of the A1 Motronic swaps, (and > generous with his findings) , I had to write him and ask him exactly how he > approached the interface issue with the different style fittings on the CIS-M > vs CIS-E Diaphragm Pressure Regulators. His initial comments were the CIS-M > Diaphragm PR was not worth converting over, and he had been using the CIS-E > one. I believe he may have re-thought this later, as he wrote me later in the > week saying he had converted to the (higher pressure ~10lb) CIS-M regulator, > and he felt improvement "across the band". > > Hopefully, I will also have some dyno charts for my CIS-M converted 2 liter > in the not > too distant future.... > > Danny > 81 Caddy > 2.0 16V Motronic > > In a message dated 5/16/01 12:13:57 PM Pacific Daylight Time, > [email protected] writes: > > << Why bother? It's still CIS based, why not step up to 1 throttle body per > cylinder and really unleash some power? Or, you could always go > side--draft carbs. On a 924 (with CIS non-lambda) I picked up 18HP just > by putting on the carbs, and that was before I tuned them all the way > spot-on, and before I did any other engine mods. With a cam, port and > polish and headers my HP went from 105HP up to almost 145! Im willing to > bet a 16V would pick up at least 20HP by ditching the KE-Motronic. Also, > FWIW, MOTRONIC is the EFI fuel system used by Porsche/BMW on such cars > as the 325 and the 944. Digifant is a simplified version of that system. > The "motronic" you guys refer to is really called "KE-MOTRONIC" as it is > a derivative of the CIS system. CIS = Cant Induce Speed, if you ask me. > Anyway, forcing the engine to lift the sensor plate is a big intake > restriction. YMMV, just thought I would chime in. > > Jay > 77 924 > 81 931 > 88 Jetta *RIP* >> > NetZero Platinum No Banner Ads and Unlimited Access Sign Up Today - Only $9.95 per month! http://www.netzero.net _____________ List Sponsor: http://www.netsville.com To remove yourself from this list, send mail to [email protected] with 'unsubscribe a2_16v' in the body of your message See us on the web at http://www.a2-16v.com Visit the 16V Homepage at http://www.gti16v.org
