Matt.
You wrote on 28 February:
> 1) Metaphysics is the general framework, or understanding, or set of
> assumptions, that people unconsciously (with various degrees of
> self-consciousness) interpret, or see, or live in the world. As an
> activity, it is the attempt to make the unconscious self-conscious
> (this activity is also known in some circles as "philosophy").
This is definitely what the MOQ aspires to, but regardless how
basic and fundamental we try to make it, the SOMish (4th. level)
Aristotelian (#2 below) definition clings to it. It takes a leap (year)
to bring oneself out of intellect and on to the MOQ proper.
> 2) Metaphysics is the branch of philosophy that attempts to display
> the basic, universal, ahistorical underpinnings of reality (this
> activity is also sometimes known in some circles as "Platonism," and
> in a few circles the acronymic "SOM").
> And, as I am wont to do, I have slotted everyone who has given an
> answer (or commented, before giving their own--against Magnus' rules,
> on someone else's) willy-nilly into two categories--
> People who like the first definition: Arlo, Steve, SA, Dewey, Pirsig
Objections, Phaedrus of ZAMM and this person have been the
only MOQ fundamentalists ... till now at least. Platt has supported
me - at times - Mati Palm-Leis too (are you listening Mati?) Chris
I believe will join this radical view?
> People who like the second definition: Me (Matt), Magnus, Marsha, Ian,
> Plato, Rorty
Agree, but add all from the list above - Pirsig too - because all
who believe that the MOQ is a mere theory ABOUT Quality aren't
true Quality Metaphysicians.
> 2) I find Magnus' distinction between an "understanding/model of the
> metaphysics" and "the metaphysics itself" to be troubling for an
> self-declared Pirsigian (as, I glean, others also feel).
You bet it's troubling, but the root of all troubles is Pirsig himself
who in LILA starts with the correct definition:
But even then the assertion that metaphysics is
meaningless sounded false to him. As long as you're
inside a logical, coherent universe of thought you can't
escape metaphysics.
... but then swerves away from it and ends up in the Aristotelian
(SOM) on metaphysic a subjective theory about an objective
something out there. The fact that the "objective" now is Quality
instead of Reality doesn't make any difference, the MOQ as a
subjective theory about objective Quality makes it a SOM variety.
Also, look how insisting on the MOQ being an intellectual pattern
indicates that the 4th. level is a mind realm where theories are.
Only the clear cut of declaring the DQ/SQ as the Quality Reality
gives the MOQ its mighty explanatory power. Without it, it's
impotent.
IMO
Bo
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