> Hi dynamic developers > > Not sure where to jump in. I'm not really interested in the politics > here, but I guess it's unavoidable to get there eventually. > > My main concern is, and have been for some time, Platt's use of MoQ > arguments to back his personal beliefs. You may think they're clear and > water-tight, but they're not. Take this one for example: > > "The Metaphysics of Quality says the free market makes everybody > richer-by preventing static economic patterns from setting in and > stagnating economic growth. That is the reason the major capitalist > economies of the world have done so much better since World War II than the > major socialist economies." (Lila, 17) > > Here, he's talking about ECONOMY, nothing else. It makes everybody > *richer*, i.e. they get more money. He says nothing about other things that > are important to people such as the long term environmental effects of such > a market.
Nor does he say the free market is detrimental to other things important to some people. > If the free market continues to run things, it will probably hit the > wall during this century, after which it will be more economically > rewarding to take environmental effects into account. If you're talking about global warming, it's not happening. > That free market may be dynamic, but it's still just a *social* pattern. > I.e. it doesn't use any intellectual reasoning. The only goal it has, the > only *value* in that market, is money. So any intellectual reasoning any > individual may use is solely used to acquire more money, i.e. to blindly > follow the incentive of the society. Money is just a measure of value and medium of exchange. Markets consist of goods and services. > On the other hand, another group of people have used their intellect to look > into what the free market, if allowed to continue, will bring in the future. > And this future doesn't look very bright. Looks brighter than ever to me, except for the constant threat to liberty from the left. > So, in MoQ terms, we have the dynamic social pattern "the free market" on > one side and we have the intellectual pattern "the environmental movement" > on the other. And the MoQ clearly states that the intellectual pattern is > more moral, because a higher level pattern *is* more dynamic than any lower > level pattern can ever be. The intellectual pattern of which you speak is phony. > The culprit of Platt's reasoning is a little strange thing about the MoQ > when applied to human societies. It's the "personal freedom" vs. "bonds of > society". The MoQ levels doesn't make it very easy to understand that, and > Bo's recurring XXX doesn't make it any easier. > > The individual person also includes intellectual patterns, but the > society does not. Then how is it moral for a society to constrain a > person? Make her pay taxes etc. You ask a very interesting question. > According to Platt, the highest moral is the individual freedom of each > person. But if that was the case, why did people start building cities in > the first place? Wouldn't it be most moral if everybody just lived by > themselves and spent their days exercising their individual freedom? > > People started building cities to protect themselves from gangs of > bandits only interested in personal short-term gain (hmm, what does that > remind me of??). So the cities, legal societies, was in fact a way to gain > *more* freedom. Freedom to create jewelery and other things attracting > bandits. > > Granted, societies have changed considerably since then, but I don't > believe for a moment that Platt most of all would like to live > completely outside it. He wants the legal protection of it like > everybody else, so all his claims about the individual freedom being > more moral than the bonds of society falls pretty flat right there. Yes, I want legal protection against biological forces. I'm willing to give up freedom for that purpose. But, that's all within the principles of the freedom in the MOQ. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
