On Monday 5 May 2008 7:08 PM Krimel addresses Magnus, Matt: Magnus said: ...it seems Pirsig left a giant hole between his biological level and his social, and this hole are by default and without much thought filled by the biological level, when it's much more logical to fill it with the social. Matt: I agree with ants and bees, but I hesitate on cells. I begin to lose hold on what the hell biological is supposed to be, let alone if you extend it even further. Then again, my knowledge of biology isn't that great. To my mind, the only way to effectively do justice to both biological evolution and cultural evolution is to toss this four level idea. Just call the major changes as you see them and sucks to trying to make Pirsig's work. After all, Pirsig came up with them for empirical reasons, though the four is a nice fit, as Plato saw, too, in his divided line. [Krimel] I think the big problem may just be in the name of the social level. Societies or banding together in groups to enhance survival is a biological strategy for reproductive success. What Pirsig is really talking about at this level is more like 'culture' which is uniquely human and the term better conveys the idea he is aiming at. I suspect, though, that after spending about a fourth of the ink in Lila trashing anthropology he just couldn't bring himself to use that term.
Hi Krimel, Matt, Magnus and all: Using esoteric literature as a guide, I describe the musical octave as an analogical template for evolution on earth. The half-tone intervals between Mi__Fa, and Si__Do are interesting in their need for shocks, special changes, for evolution in a description of reproduction. This description of evolution is from the bottom up. Do inorganic, reproduction by collision. Re single-celled organic organism, which reproduces by division. Mi a multi-celled organic organism, which reproduces by cell-wall penetration, a donor for the other cell leads to diversification. Fa, to cross this half tone interval requires a shock. Proprietary awareness (undefined consciousness) evolves through a special shock in breathing to the social level. Cell-wall penetration reproduction in the evolutionary template, becomes a very lonely place at the social level of self-awareness. Emptiness requires a completing mate with special behavior patterns. Sol is a conscious/matter evolution. Two are distinct! Necessary laws adjust their behavior, the intellectual level. La is a movement in consciousness only (self remembering) to a higher-social level. Si is a further conscious evolution to an awareness of the cosmic reality of consciousness, a higher intellectual level. Evolution of sentient life stops at the half-tone and can not progress to a new octave. The moon has to be satisfied with what sentient life can provide it. Joe On 5/4/08 7:08 PM, "Krimel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Magnus said: > ...it seems Pirsig left a giant hole between his biological level and his > social, and this hole are by default and without much thought filled by the > biological level, when it's much more logical to fill it with the social. > > Matt: > I agree with ants and bees, but I hesitate on cells. I begin to lose hold > on what the hell biological is supposed to be, let alone if you extend it > even further. Then again, my knowledge of biology isn't that great. To my > mind, the only way to effectively do justice to both biological evolution > and cultural evolution is to toss this four level idea. Just call the major > changes as you see them and sucks to trying to make Pirsig's work. After > all, Pirsig came up with them for empirical reasons, though the four is a > nice fit, as Plato saw, too, in his divided line. > > [Krimel] > I think the big problem may just be in the name of the social level. > Societies or banding together in groups to enhance survival is a biological > strategy for reproductive success. What Pirsig is really talking about at > this level is more like 'culture' which is uniquely human and the term > better conveys the idea he is aiming at. I suspect, though, that after > spending about a fourth of the ink in Lila trashing anthropology he just > couldn't bring himself to use that term. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
