[SA]
How many times have we in our lives
heard somebody's ideas and thought of them as
frightening and horrible?  So horrible that if those
ideas, those creative patterns, were able to enact
social patterns, we think to ourselves, this culture
would head for destruction?  

[Krimel]
What a concise summary of my thoughts on the Bush presidency.

[SA]
Thus, control lost not only on the inside, but outside too. 
How much can the outside contain problems before these
more concrete structures of external control fail?  I
would say large, very large populations have something
to do with having the physical numbers of people to
show brute force in containment.  Not that large
populations mean more disorder exists so more people
needed to control these disorders within the culture,
but I am saying that if more disorder happens, then
the need for more people to contain this disorder or
more technology, thus, more external culture.

[Krimel]
Exactly, and my point is that a just society fosters internal loci of
control. People internalize the rules and obey them because they understand
how their failure to do so potentially harms them and others around them.
One of the marks of history has been the number of people that societies can
support. 



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