Steve to Platt:

Platt:
Yes. The SOM intellectual level (not pattern) is what Pirsig is talking
about here -- the level that became "supreme" over the social level,
upsetting Rigel and causing him to dump on Pirsig.

Steve:
I never said that the intellectual level is a pattern, rather it is a
type of pattern.
I know that you view the levels as types of people rather than types
of patterns. This is a misconception. Though the levels help us to
understand people by understadning what pattern dominate diferent
people, if you do a search for "intellectual level" in Lila, you will
never see Pirsig refer to someone as "being on the intellectual
level"--a phrase that is used regularly in this forum. What you will
find is the frequent use of the phrase "intellectual level of
evolution" and references to patterns as in the following:
etc etc,

Andre:

Hi Steve, Platt and all,

By intellectual level Pirsig means to include all the patterns that define
that level. It was this SOM intellectual level, i.e. including all its
derivatives (patterns) he held responsible for the mess we are in and to
tackle this level he had to go where, as far as he knew, no one had ever
gone before. Out of this quest arose the MoQ.
Aristotle's (S/O) metaphysics (search for Truth) arose out of the social
level after a battle with the Sophists (search for Good). Truth won, The
Good lost. Rhetoric stayed at the social level and perhaps transformed into
the Church (!?). Since SOM's renaissance it has been in constant conflict
with the Church and after Armistice Day, when this intellectual level,and
all its patterns, claimed the driver's seat, it has been the dominating
intellectual level.

I don't particularly like creating another level. Before we know it we have
created ourselves a MoQ Tower of Babel! But what Pirsig has done was not
simply applying some cosmetic surgery to this level ( he didn't simply
change a bit of terminology, added a bit here, rearranging a bit there to
'help' SOM).He expanded it but almost beyong recognition. He didn't want SOM
to be overlaid with prettiness (ZMM p287). As he suggests earlier: 'To
arrive at...Quality requires a somewhat different procedure from the Step 1,
Step 2, step 3 instructions that accompany dualistic technology [and S/O
science]... (ZMM p 286).

He sought a complete unification and has applied major ECT (pardon the
analogy)!!
He has created a completely new personality.SOM into MoQ.
BUT by suggesting that the MoQ is a static intellectual pattern sitting
nicely, side by side with SOM, within the same level is expressing a mind
divided against itself. The MoQ is 'opposed' to SOM for reasons that have
been stated left, right and center in our posts (and many more) i.e.not
recognising Quality.
BUT Pirsig brings the MoQ back into the S/O camp by suggesting his
definition of the meaning of the intellectual level. (see letter to Paul
Turner). 'Abstract manipulation' presupposes 'concrete manipulation'. This
is reinforcing the S/O distinction again.
SQ is supposed to designate the unification of subject/object ( the romantic
and classic 'understanding that led him on this path in the first place) and
the MoQ is that. DQ/SQ.

His own definition, to make it more meaningful, does not reflect the massive
job he has carried out.
MoQ 'inspired' intellectualisation means being informed, reflecting and
being conscious of all processes at all levels, including the responses to
quality events. Instead of reducing this level it needs to be expanded again
to render it more meaningful! In this way you also remove this dualistic
S/O thinking. We are these processes and these patterns (Lila p158)!!
Maybe we need to completely rethink our intellectual processing. They do
include all levels.

Our current SOM Intellectual level stops us from direct experience. 'Kill
all intellectual patterns' (Lila p 406).

I think the 'expanded' version places us in the Code of Art area and in this
sense 'closer' to DQ.

For what it is worth.
Andre
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