Hi Bodvar and Michael, this is an interesting exchange; > However, faith precedes reason. Agree! > Skepticism IMO is the failure of reason to accept that preconditional > aspect of faith. Even more agreement. The MOQ says that intellect (the level) has social roots, i.e. reason is "out of faith". Now, intellect or reason is simultaneously MOQ's highest static level and SOM (for those who won't see the Quality Idea) so this is really an impasse: Now I was about to launch on my other special field, namely how the MOQ reconciles faith and reason, subject and object in a way that let us have the cake and eat it, but that will have to wait. Keep thinking and posting.
Andre: In anticipation of what you are promising us Bodvar I suggest that faith does not precede reason. Rather, reason, an intellectual PoV arisen out of Soc. Pov , when not accepted by certain adherents (clinging) to certain static Soc. PoV's i.e being sceptical about a particular level of reasoning (as it did not meet/approved of their social experience) being overwhelmed by this self same reason (ing) (DQ) developed a faith ( adherence to SQ), a wishing away, of the hard facts based upon this reason(ing)(DQ). Thus faith and reason had to emerge simultaneously or around about the same time. Reason is not out of faith.( In your example the cave man never doubting the fact that the stars were gods). Faith is out of reason. The problem is that I think we are operating from a SOM perspective. Faith (subjective) reason (objective). Never the twain shall meet. Or, let's be rather more optimistic: the two are reconciled in a wonderful dance of promise for the better. i.e Quality. For what it is worth Andre Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
