On 13 May 2009 at 8:37, John Carl wrote: > On Tue, May 12, 2009 at 12:48 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Guns and other deadly weapons are made in communist, socialist, fascist and > > other > > economic systems besides capitalist. So that's not the issue. The issue is > > who can > > legally use them to coerce people to do things. You and I and businesses we > > work > > for can't. Governments can. > > > But Platt, what difference does it make when huge corporations lobby, bribe > and pressure their governments to do their coercing for them?
Seems to me there's a world of difference between wanting something done and wielding a gun to coerce somebody to do it. It's the difference between a trader and a soldier or policeman. If you mean that many politicians and bureaucrats accept bribes, I agree. > > What is often called "slave labor" is also called cheap labor compared to > > the cost > > of union labor. What is often called "exploitation" is also called a better > > living by > > those affected. What are often called "sweetheart deals" are also called > > corrupt > > politics. As for the "statist propaganda machine" being capitalist, I > > simply > > refer you to how the major media slant the news in favor of Statists. > > > > There is a very cozy relationship between gargantuan state and gargantuan > capitalism. Ike's famous prayer, God help this country from falling into > the hands of the military-industrial complex, illustrates that this is an > actual danger. Ike saw first hand how easy it is to bribe politicians and bureaucrats whose goal is unearned power. > Power corrupts, whether the power is in the hands of the state or > corporations. The power to legally imprison and kill is far different from the power to make money by offering goods and services people want to buy. > The wonderful thing about a free market is > > that buyer and seller, with competing and sometimes hostile egos, both get > > what they want peacefully. > I agree. I just think there is a better way to do this than our current > system. And I'd like to chime in with Paco from an earlier contribution to > this thread: What better way would that be? > >From Paco: > > IMO, Capitalism as a social system with its corresponding selfish ideology > should be exposed for what it is from the point of view of Quality. (snip) > > So Pirsigians, unite! Down with the pretense. I believe people have a > sense Quality to come up with viable alternatives to capitalism. Nobody who supports capitalism suggests that it is based on people with motivations like those of Mother Teresa. If somebody has a idea on how to eliminate selfishness from humanity, I'm all ears. Until then, why not take advantage of human nature by letting selfishness motivate the production and consumption of goods and services within a DQ free market. It may not be perfect, but compared to the alternatives . . .? Platt Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
