Ron Natural laws are a collective ideal. "all men are created equal" I think Ham would have issue with that little endorsement of collectivist propaganda.
Platt That phrase sanctions the primacy of the individual, not the collective. Ron: The primacy of the individual as equative with the collective. You are the same as everyone else. You are equal with all humans. You yourself say that this simply is not true. That some people are better than others, the people created in some cultures are better than other people created in different cultures. ________________________________ From: Platt Holden <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 10:32:14 AM Subject: Re: [MD] An Observation From An Outsider On Wed, Jun 10, 2009 at 10:01 AM, X Acto <[email protected]> wrote: > Platt, > You forget that Horse owns and operates this website and censors how he > sees fit. > He is not an agent of the government and the MoQ or the discuss are not > government > intitutions and therefore he has the right to not tolerate this sort of > violent rhetoric if he so > chooses. I think he has been very tolerant and liberal in his decisions, I > doubt you would offer > the same graces. > Platt Of course Horse can block Nick's posts if he so chooses. Who is to stop him? I was appealing to a principle which Horse has chosen to ignore. If you don't think the principle applies in this case, fine. I will always defend your right to express your views. Ron You despise socialism but apeal to a socialist ideal of "social rights" Platt The right I appeal to is an "individual" right, not "social." Societies don't speak. Ron Horse is excercising his individual choice and you should respect that being a purveyeor of individualism. Platt I do. I also have expressed my gratitude for his management of this site without cost to us beneficiaries many times. Just as I respect his right as manager to muzzle Nick, I respect the right of Nick to participate here under the intellectual right of free speech. There seems to be a hidden assumption among some here that they have a monopoly on "goodness" and "truth." I consider such arrogance not only low quality but dangerous. Ron Natural laws are a collective ideal. "all men are created equal" I think Ham would have issue with that little endorsement of collectivist propaganda. Platt That phrase sanctions the primacy of the individual, not the collective. ________________________________ From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 9:35:27 AM > Subject: Re: [MD] An Observation From An Outsider > > On 9 Jun 2009 at 14:08, Louise Pryor wrote: > > > Americans who hate their country, hate it with the naive ferocity of > those > > who have no idea how the rest of the world operates. Having lived in a > > socialist monarchy, under a military dictatorship, in a tropical > paradise, > > and in a democracy, I have a different view of America. The hope my > father > > had, when he brought us here (legally) was of America as the land of > > promise. "In America anyone can be anything they want to be" was his > > understanding. He came here with $400 in his pocket and the promise of a > > job. And because what he believed is true, he found what he was looking > for. > > > > I grant that the American government is not perfect, and may be far from > > what the founding fathers had in mind, but it still has a foundation of > > freedom, whereby Nick can declare his "rights to personal property" - > right > > out loud - with very little actual threat that anyone will come in and > take > > it away from him - and plenty of recourse if anyone did. > > > > "Rights to personal property", and "individual rights", are not something > > commonly recognized world wide. The rest of the world sees Americans, in > > general, as greedy, spoiled children. > > > > "I have my rights, sir, and I'm telling you, I intend to go on doing just > > what I do!" (the Onceler to the Lorax, Dr. Seuss) > > > > Lu > > Well said, Lu. Unfortunately we see the socialist mind at work in the > overt censorship of Nick whose presence here has been summarily > taken away from him by fiat while those who blasphemed him as a > "whack-job," "paranoid violent nutcase," and "time for your meds again" > are given a free pass. Although I find ad hominem attacks a sign that > the attacker has nothing of value to say, I would never attempt to take > away his right to say it. Supreme Court Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes > expressed the essence of free speech as etched in the U.S. > Constitution: > > "If there is any principle of the Constitution that more imperatively calls > for attachment than any other it is the principle of free thought--not free > thought for those who agree with us but freedom for the thought we > hate." > > It's clear that many Europeans and others around the world do not share > this quintessential American value. > > Platt > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > > > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
