Hey John, Comments below.
On 15 Jan 2010 at 15:58, John Carl wrote: > Harumph, Platt, who said anything about pantheism? > > You said "Mother Nature worshipper" Did you think Pantheism is the same as > nature worship? Yep. Among the worshippers are groups like Greenpeace and the Audubon Society, also known as the watermelon crowd. > Worship means, "that from which we get our values". If I worship money, > then making money has the highest value for me. If I worship nature, then > nature has the highest value for me. If I'm a pantheist in the traditional > sense, then I believe in objectified aspects of nature, reified as "gods" > and my actual worship is of a set of cultural beliefs within the context of > a whole culture. > > So pardon me for defending you if by "nature worship", you meant > "pantheism". I take it back. > > I am not a pantheist, but I am a nature worshipper. Nature is life, the > life force is the only definition of good that makes sense to a pragmatist. I equate the life force with Dynamic Quality, a moral force as real and as powerful as the forces of gravity, electromagnetism, and strong and weak atomic. Otherwise, the rise of life from non-life cannot be explained other than "Oops." Regards, Platt. > > On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 1:46 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Hey John, > > > > Pantheism is the religion of SOM science which, as the quoted passage > > makes clear, is responsible for the belief that man's "whole life is that > > of > > an animal that lives and thinks like any other animal." The MOQ doesn't > > support such a warped view. > > > > Best, > > Platt > > > > > > > > > > On 15 Jan 2010 at 11:56, John Carl wrote: > > > > > Greetings Arlo, > > > > > > You are both absolutely right and absolutely wrong in your reaction to > > > Platt's post. You are right when you point out that Platt's Pirsig quote > > > actually supports, nurtures and reinforces the "Worshippers of Mother > > Nature > > > in the church of environmentalism". You are wrong though in your > > analysis > > > of his reason for doing so. > > > > > > You really, really have issues with this guy, I know. But it blinds you > > > somewhat to what he actually says. > > > > > > Heck, you've got such blinder on concerning Platt, you even only see me > > in > > > relation to him!: > > > > > > "With John, I don't know, he admits to being ignorant about theories > > > of emergence, but this does not seemingly stop him from (at the very > > > least) supporting Platt's sophomoric mischaracterization." > > > > > > See? What I say doesn't matter nearly as much as whether it support's > > > Platt's position. > > > > > > Isn't that a bit dogmatic? > > > > > > But hey, don't take it as criticism. Knock yourself out if that's what > > you > > > enjoy. Personally, I hate shadowboxing and losing. > > > > > > John > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 6:45 AM, Arlo Bensinger <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > [Platt] > > > > > > > > Worshippers of Mother Nature in the church of environmentalism would do > > > > well to ponder the following passage from Pirsig's MOQ: > > > > > > > > [Arlo] > > > > Sometimes you are so blinded by your zeal to post your pet quotes, you > > miss > > > > the irony that they actually support the very thing you think you are > > > > attacking. Aside from the moronic conflation here, and the always > > insipid > > > > attempt to paint environmentalism broadly as a "theism", your quote > > serves > > > > the notion that the lack of connectedness in modern society is a result > > of > > > > "theism" (separating "man" not only from his environment but denying > > > > interconnectedness in toto), as opposed to "pantheistic" thinking. The > > > > "scientific intellectual culture" of "millions of isolated people" > > stems > > > > from the S/O bent of Western Culture, a view that "man" is somehow > > forever > > > > "outside", an observer, a dis-connected isolated thing- the opposite > > view > > > > from those your deceptive rhetoric tries to attack. If you are going to > > use > > > > your pet quotes, at least take the time to make sure you understand > > them. > > > > > > > > "I know what it is! We've arrived at the West Coast! We're all > > strangers > > > > again! Folks, I just forgot the biggest gumption trap of all. The > > funeral > > > > procession! The one everybody's in, this hyped-up, fuck-you, > > supermodern, > > > > ego style of life that thinks it owns this country. We've been out of > > it for > > > > so long I'd forgotten all about it." (ZMM) Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
