I'm not in the mood. I have a headache.
On Mar 9, 2010, at 1:01 PM, david buchanan wrote: > > Marsha said to dmb: > To speak of a reality that is a monism using a language that is based on a > dualistic reality comprised of subjects and objects is difficult. > > > dmb says: > > It's more difficult to talk about monisms and dualisms than it is to talk > about fish and breadsticks but that doesn't address the point. The point is > that you're treating intellectual static quality patterns as if they were > unpatterned, dynamic and ineffable. Concepts are not ineffable. When Pirsig > says that, "any philosophic explanation of Quality is going to be both false > and true precisely because it is a philosophic explanation", he is saying > that Quality is not conceptual but philosophic explanations are conceptual. > (ZMM, Chapter 20) This matches the claim he makes in chapter 5 of Lila, where > he says philosophical mystics, "share a common belief that the fundamental > nature of reality is outside language". It matches what he tells us in > chapter 9, where he says, "even the name, 'Quality' was a kind of definition > since it tended to associate mystic reality with certain fixed and limited > understandings." And then there is the explanation at the end of chapter 29, > where qu ot > es William James saying, "there must always be a discrepancy between concepts > and reality, because the former are static and discontinuous while the latter > is dynamic and flowing". See? > > He makes the same point when he says that the MOQ is a contradiction because > metaphysics is a philosophic explanation full of concepts and definitions > whereas Quality (DQ) is what you know prior to definitions, ahead of > definitons. > > To use the ineffable, non-conceptual nature of Quality to shut down a > conversation about the meaning of concepts is, I think, not a legitimate > move. I mean, dealing with difficult concepts is one thing but treating them > as pre-conceptual and indefinable only confuses Pirsig's often repeated > point. Does that point make sense to you? You see what I'm saying? > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469229/direct/01/ > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html ___ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
