Dan commented on Pirsig's ghost story:
...What RMP is getting at in the passages above is that gravity isn't a
physical process. Nor is Quality. The fact that we "know" all about Newton and
gravity makes us very certain about the "external" world existing apart from
our own self. And the MOQ says that the idea that the world exists is a high
quality idea. But it is only an idea. There is no way to be certain that there
really is a world "out there" apart from the self.
dmb says:
Right. This ghost story is all about the problem of reification. Even if you
don't know the term, it's pretty clear that you get the idea.
Somebody asked Pirsig if apples obeyed the law of gravity before Newton
invented it. No, he said, they just fell. There is the ancient idea that
material objects fall down because that is there natural place in God's order.
Newton's explanation for that is very different and Einstein's is different
from Newton's. Each of these explanations come with a fairly elaborate
metaphysical context and thereby add a whole bunch of invisible forces BEHIND
our ordinary, concrete experiences, behind those falling apples just as you
experienced it.
The whole of reality as we conceive it is an evolved pile of analogies, right?
This is another way to talk about the ghosts of rationality. Either way we are
talking about the mythos within which we think and talk. We invent earth and
sky, gods and laws, religions and sciences and that's our static reality. But
all of this was generated in response to Quality. That's why it can't be
defined. It is the generator of the mythos, of the whole system of definable
static realities. And the mythos we inherit is a product of evolution. It's a
pile of inventions that have worked well enough that they have survived and
been passed on for further use. And it will continue to evolve but not so
quickly that my words will lose all meaning by this afternoon. The meaning of
"gravity" can change over the centuries but that doesn't mean the definition is
some ineffable mystery. Some people will have a richer or deeper understanding
of the term but that doesn't alter the definition. That's just
a matter of how much time and energy one spends on the concept. And it's not
really a different concept if you say it in French or German either.
The ghosts that make up our mythos have been so darn successful that it's
normal to believe that our inventions are not inventions, that "gravity" is not
just a concept about reality but reality itself. Same thing goes for "subject"
and "objects" and "objective reality" and "substance" and "God".
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