Hi Dan,
>>> dmb says: >>> If Pirsig can reject the Cartesian self or SOM's self and STILL say that >>> one's behavior is free to some extent, then why can't we? >> >> Steve: >> Sure, one can _say_ it, but is it true, and what does it even mean to say so? >> >> I noticed that quote too when I read the NY Times article, and I was >> struck by the fact that he doesn't talk about choice but rather >> perception. >> >> dmb: >> I mean, don't the Pirsig quotes prove that the question of free will >> can be answered without committing yourself to the metaphysical >> framework we've already rejected? The question of freedom is still a >> question about you and your life, don't you think? >> >> >> Steve: >> Well now you slipped free _will_ into this picture where Pirsig talked >> behavior and perception rather than _will_ being free. >> >> I can't make much of his claim "To the extent that you perceive >> dynamic quality, you make your own life." To what extent _do_ we >> perceive dynamic quality? > > Dan: > > To the extent that we put static patterns to sleep by learning to > ignore them. Meditation is one possible path. > >>How could we behave so as to perceive more >> or less of it? > > By doing what we love versus doing what we are told. > >>If dynamic quality is the leading edge of experience, >> how does anyone _not_ perceive it? > > By covering "it" up. By intellectualizing "it" away. > >>Why does he see perception rather >> than will as the key to human freedom where most philosophers of the >> past have been concerned with a particular sort of the capacity to >> choose? > > Perception is Dynamic. Will is seen as an illusion in the MOQ. > >> Unfortunately, rather than shed light one the matter, for me >> this quote just muddles things further. > > You think too much. I had been planning to respond as I was reading until I came to your conclusion: "You think too much." One of the reasons I love the MD is because it is usually the last place in my world where I expect to encounter such anti-intellectual conversation stoppers. I assume you meant it in some other way, but I don't know how to proceed since I am not sure how you meant it. Anyway, I am glad you agree that willed choice is not the locus of human freedom in the MOQ. Best, Steve Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
