Hi Marsha, Who is the "I" who has not found an autonomous self, as you claim. Is a contingent self claiming it knows what an autonomous self is? Does a painter know how to look for a neutrino? The fact that you are looking in good faith may imply imply that you know what an autonomous self looks like instinctively. This may mean it exists.
You are trying to see your eyes. I do not think that is possible. It doesn't mean your eyes do not exist if you can't see them. Even if you see your eyes in a mirror, how do you know they are yours? You have to accept that on faith. You cannot find the seeker, you cannot taste your taster, you cannot hear your hearer. Does this mean that they don't exist? All I can tell you is look in a different way. If you can't find your car keys it does not mean they don't exist. You have lost yourself, but keep looking. It could also mean that the topic is meaningless, like looking for the backside of water. If you believe that your Self is contingent, then you may be a fatalist. You are and you create. The whole universe depends on you to make it complete. It could not function otherwise. With autonomous self comes responsibility. Denying the autonomous self is simply taming one's ego. Obviously the ego cannot deny the ego, so one cannot will oneself to push that ego down into balance. It happens through the non ego or the non intellect. Such is the method towards enlightenment. Once the tool is used, it can be thrown away. Denying the autonomous self is clinging to a tool, imo. At some point you may let go and move on. One possibility is to stop looking and to start doing. Drop that ego and start trying. It is a humbling experience. Another three page essay of nonsense. Don't be too hard on me. Mark On Oct 9, 2011, at 12:28 PM, MarshaV <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Greetings Mark, > > You are mistaken... I have never found an autonomous self, and since I have > not found an 'autonomous self' to exist, I find no reason to accept an > autonomous self or reject it. > > > Marsha > > > > On Oct 9, 2011, at 1:55 PM, 118 wrote: > >> Hi Marsha, >> I suppose you are speaking theoretically. From your posts it is clear that >> you believe that an autonomous self exists. Trust your intuition above your >> logic, it is much more real. >> >> Mark >> >> On Oct 9, 2011, at 12:10 AM, MarshaV <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> >>> Greetings Ham, >>> >>> >>> Here's the crux of the matter for me. There is the concept of an >>> 'autonomous self' >>> and the experience of a 'subjective perspective'. I have never found any >>> autonomous self, but I do seem to experience a subjective perspective. >>> Since I >>> have not found an 'autonomous self' to exist, I find no reason to accept a >>> self or >>> reject it. >>> >>> >>> Marsha >>> > > > > ___ > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
