> [djh said] > The MOQ expands rationality by allowing us to discuss *all* values not just > intellectual values. Included as part of all values are even those undefined > better values which create intellectual patterns to begin with. From this > Dynamic Quality perspective static quality is degenerate.. > > [Ron responded] > But you also contend that Dynamic Quality perspective does not exist > no one ever has this perspective or ever could. we cant say anything > about it. So how can one say how it views static quality?
[djh] Folks do experience DQ. All the time. Even if calling it a 'perspective' is wrong - this doesn't mean that it doesn't exist or that we cannot intellectually talk about it. > [djh said previously] > Here's a couple of RMP quotes to *intellectually* support my point.. > "[Dynamic Quality's] only perceived evil is static quality itself." - Lila > and of course.. > "Writing a metaphysics is, in the strictest mystic sense, a degenerate > activity." > > [Ron] > But you forgot that a ruthless doctrine to preserve purity is a degeneracy > fanatics are made of > To cling to DQ alone is to cling to chaos. [djh] Right I don't see how I forgot that? Depending on which 'perspective' you speak from (DQ - sq) it's always going to be at neglect of the other. > [djh previously] > There are different pespectives of the MOQ dmb. There is the intellectual > perspective which you seem to be stuck in. And there is also a 'perspective' > of the MOQ which is *outside*, *before* and actually the 'perspective' which > *creates* the intellectual level. This is the non-'perspective' of DQ. To > repeat myself - the MOQ *expands rationality* by including this 'perspective' > and other value perspectives as part of its metaphysical structure. From a > DQ or strictly mystic understanding - static quality is evil and degenerate. > RMP and myself can intellectually say that. Why can't you? > > [Ron] > But this perspective DOES NOT EXIST....no one has it! no one can! why include > it if it is meaningless? > why include it if it has no value? it does not exist....there is no gods eye > view. [djh] DQ does exist. That is why it is included as part of the MOQ. > [Ron] > it does not exist djh only for Bodvar and his followers it is a rational > assumption that has no basis in experience… [djh responds] Far from no basis in experience - Dynamic Quality is direct experience itself. > [Ron] > You are interpreting selected quotes to support your interpretation of what > Pirsig is saying which contradicts other Pirsig quotes, but that is ok you > say because Pirsig accepts contradiction and so this supports the fact that > your interpretation makes no sense. It must be correct then. yikes! One can > intellectualy say any thing meaningless we call that bullshit, lies and > disallusionment, they are usually dishonest and selfish ways to fool and > decieve others and assert superiority over them. -"what great luck it is for > rulers that men do not think" -Adolf Hitler ...muuuuu…. [djh] There is a clear contradiction between what is good Dynamically and what is good statically.. It is this contradiction/conflict which creates the universe as we know it.. "The priests had proclaimed themselves good and the brujo evil. The brujo had proclaimed himself good and the priests evil. A showdown had occurred and the brujo had won!" .. "Although Dynamic Quality, the Quality of freedom, creates this world in which we live, these patterns of static quality, the quality of order, preserve our world. Neither static nor Dynamic Quality can survive without the other. If one inserts this concept into a case such as that of the brujo in Zuni, one can see the truth of it. Although the Dynamic brujo and the static priests who tortured him appeared to be mortal enemies, they were actually necessary to each other. Both types of people had to exist. If most of Zuni went around drunk and bragging and looking in windows, that ancient way of life could never have lasted. But without wild, disreputable outcasts like the brujo, ready to seize on any new outside idea and bring it into the community, Zuni would have been too inflexible to survive. A tension between these two forces is needed to continue the evolution of life." Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
