[Arlo]
 Pirsig's philosophy contains NO pre-existing forms, substances, patterns. 
There are no pre-conceptual patterns sitting out there waiting for us to 
'experience' them.

DM: As you can't read let me repeat,  yes nothing precedes experience as our 
starting point,  but we do find pre-conceptual patterns in experience,  we call 
this quality, now conceptually when we try to make intellectual sense of 
experience we can very easily work out patterns exist outside of direct 
experience,  put a biscuit in a tin,  open it an hour later and the biscuit 
will still be there,  how would you explain this miracle,  witchcraft? No 
intellectual integrity round here it seems! I reject all talk of substances,  
objectivity and subjectivity,  you are obsessed with it,  go read Paul Levi 
Bryant and improve your education. Realism and SOM are not inseparable,  this 
is the sort of thing intellect can analyse and clarify,  you should try some,  
pathetic.





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