[Craig] In short, Marx is "concerned" with freedom in the same sense Hitler was concerned with theJewish population. He wanted to eliminate it.
[Arlo] You're applying just what Marx, in that passage, lamented, what he called "bougeousie notions of freedom" (ie, something less than real freedom). If you start with one notion (proprety = freedom), then its easy to say that anything that is against "property" is against freedom. Marx denied this, saying that property and freedom are not synonymous, but that this is a deceit thrust upon man by the mercantilists who seek to enslave man within a prison of unending commodity fetishism and property acquisition. To equate this with Hitler and the genocide is simply attrocious rhetoric, Craig. Something I expect from Platt, but though better about from you. The end-goal of Marxism is to abolish "the state" altogether. Man, he argued, when freed from the bonds of labor-slavery, would form mutually enabling "communes" of self-regulation and participation. Freed from the desire to accumulate material goods, man would work together towards loftier goals of social accomplishment and individual enlightenment. As I've said, its apparent in 2007 that Marx was woefully naive in his optimism about human nature. Some Marxists hold out that one day man will awaken and regain control of his labor (and life), but I am in the "I dont think so" camp. moq_discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
