Diana we're talking about filling MMA nails with hard gel (not gel polish).
Are you unconfused now ?? ;)
Laura
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Diana Bonn
Sent: November-23-12 3:49 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: NailTech:: gel sticking to cheap ac: was Re: What to say to clients
who think that an NSS salon nails are beautiful?
Okay guys, I am sooo confused...I have never had trouble with gel polish
sticking to any type of ac. Just as long as there is no shiny spots, no
problem,
Now if I have problems with a gel polish sticking it is a gel issue, not an
ac issue. Interesting to what kind of info we get from other techs...the
reason this list is awesome!!!! (and I am talking polish
with gel, or gel with pigment) diana from indiana
At 02:54 PM 11/23/2012, you wrote:
>I use Light Elegance gel. It just chips off cheep acrylic. Good brands
>like CND, OPI, Entity, etc are not a problem as long as I use Protein
>Bond by Young Nails between the acrylic and gel. That cheep NSS acrylic
>is nothing like the name brands, it is ridiculous hard to file and
>ridiculous hard to soak off and whatever (MMA?) is in it stops the gel
>from sticking to it. Maybe if I just buffed the gel top coat, but
>didn't remove it, my gel would stick, but, the nails are so thick and
>ugly shaped that I still don't want my name on them if I can't reshape
>them, thin them out and properly balance the apex.
>
>Some acrylic companies have gel top coat that is specially formulated
>to adhere to their acrylic, but it is just a top coat, it is not strong
>enough to be used as a fill product and most of them do not have a
>tacky layer so they cannot be used as a base or primer to make the UV
>gel adhere to the acrylic.
>
>Please, if anyone has found a way to get their gel to stick to cheep
>acrylic, share the trick.
>
>Katherine
>Nails at Panache
>St. Louis, MO
>Sent from my iPad
>
>On Nov 23, 2012, at 12:17 PM, Jill in Ky
><<mailto:[email protected]>[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Your gel won't adhere over cheap acrylic? I'm not a gel tech, but am
>>eager to learn more about it, so can you explain to me the chemistry
>>behind WHY it won't adhere if you take the shine off the top of the
>>old nail product?
>>
>>I'd really like to know because I thought you could use a camouflaging
>>pink gel to help hide the fill lines. If that's not the case, then
>>maybe I need to stick to acrylic where I can custom blend the powder
>>to help hide other nail techs fill lines. For all the gel techs out
>>there, jump in to help instruct me on this, ok?
>>
>>Jill W.
>>
>>On Thursday, November 22, 2012 5:57:24 PM UTC-6, Katherine Fahrig wrote:
>>I understand what you are saying and I agree in principal. However, in
>>this situation, that is not going to work. She wears a French
>>Manicure, so the yellow acrylic and fill lines show through my crystal
>>clear gel product. Additionally, my gel will not adhere to cheep NSS
>>acrylic. So, the problem is that the finished nails look horrible with
>>the yellow ac and fill lines showing AND they will not hold up. My gel
>>will chip off the top of that NSS ac in less than a week. I do not
>>want my name on those nails. I do not want her telling everyone that
>>those yellow, fill lined and chipping nails are my work.
>>
>>Back in the day, when I did acrylic nails, I had an opaque pink that I
>>used on clients who came to me with horrid yellow acrylic on their
>>nails and I was proud to have my name on my work because I could make
>>the nails look good despite the crappy product underneath. Even if I
>>used an opaque pink gel, it would still chip off the top of the NSS
>>acrylic. The only thing I could do is start doing acrylic nails again.
>>Not going to happen for my own reasons, long story that is a whole
>>different thread.
>>
>>It's not an ego thing, it's a reputation thing. I will not put my name
>>on yellow, fill lined nails. That is not what my work looks like. I
>>use top quality products that do not yellow and correct
>>(manufacturers) technique that does not leave fill lines. I do not
>>view a good work ethic as "ego".
>>
>>I get what you are saying, but, this situation is not about ego, it's
>>about my name on substandard work. I have other clients who get their
>>nails done in other states, one who gets her nails done in Vancouver,
>>BC, I have no problem doing their nails. No, the work is not as good
>>as mine ( that part is ego ) but they all use a quality gel and I can
>>do my work with my gel over it and with one appointment I can produce
>>nails that deserve my name on them. I do not bad mouth the other salon
>>or manicurist, I like to hear about how things are in the other city
>>for my clients who live part time here and part time there, it's a fun
>>and exciting life that I can live vicariously through. It's not about
>>me having to convince anyone that I'm better than the other
>>manicurist. It doesn't matter, I do their nails when they are in STL
>>and the other manicurist does their nails when they are there. No
>>competition, we are actually working together, sharing the client. I'm
>>cool with that. I'm not cool with someone telling a client that they
>>are getting gels when they are getting acrylic and then the client
>>expects me to make her yellow, fill lined acrylic look like the clear,
>>natural gel nails that I'm known for creating.
>>
>>I do not think that anyone should put their name on work that is
>>beneath them. Every single set of nails that walk out of my salon meet
>>my standards for quality, beauty and durability. That is customer
>>service. That is a full book of happy, satisfied clients.
>>That is a reputation in this city that I am the best.
>>
>>Belittling, berating or insulting a client, coworker, manicurist
>>(licensed or not) is not good customer service. Doing substandard work
>>over a substandard foundation in not good customer service.
>>
>>Katherine
>>Nails at Panache
>>St. Louis, MO
>>Sent from my iPad
>>
>>On Nov 22, 2012, at 11:03 AM, Jill in Ky <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>Katherine, I feel your pain & I hate when that happens! It is so
>>>frustrating, but this is how I've learned to handle it after 25+
>>>years in the business- it all boils down to psychology:
>>>
>>> After I've tried to educate someone & they still aren't getting it,
>>> I stop trying. For me, I can recognize the feeling of being
>>> defensive when it comes on me & it serves no purpose. I have to
>>> reign in that emotion because ultimately I do not want to alienate
>>> the client (no matter how stupid they appear to be). My goal has to
>>> be focused on giving her the best possible service in the time that
>>> she's booked. If that means filling over someone else's crappy work,
>>> then I'll do my best to make it look right & create a stable nail
>>> (ultimately it will be her new nail techs problem when her acrylic
>>> starts to break down). Then I direct the conversation to something
>>> else more pleasant, the hour goes fast, and then she pays me. It's
>>> not easy, but I try to take my ego out of the equation.
>>>
>>>Think about it from the client's point of view......by YOU
>>>contradicting what she's telling you & pointing out her new nail
>>>techs flaws, the client is being made to feel like SHE made a poor
>>>choice in salons because she's ignorant. No one want's to feel that
>>>way, including ourselves. So then the client keeps talking about how
>>>beautiful & wonderful the new salon is & how great their services
>>>are, because that's HER way of trying to convince YOU that she DID
>>>make a good choice. She has a need for your approval, but she doesn't
>>>realize that it hurts your feelings & puts you on the defensive, so
>>>both of you get nowhere. It's frustrating on both sides because both
>>>peoples egos are involved.
>>>
>>>Obviously, the other salon is exciting to her because it's new.
>>>She was probably excited about your salon back when she became a new
>>>client, too. The new tech probably strokes her ego in ways that you
>>>don't anymore, because we all get familiar with long time clients &
>>>thus, the honeymoon phase goes out the window. It's only natural that
>>>it will eventually happen with this new salon, too.
>>>Then when you eventually see her she'll start to complain about them.
>>>
>>>I wouldn't turn her away or insist that she soak off for a new full
>>>set, but that's just me. I wouldn't want her to leave my salon with
>>>hard feelings because SHE won't understand why after all these years
>>>YOU are giving her the boot, plus she will tell everyone in town
>>>about how she was so rudely dismissed as a long time client by you.
>>>And what if she doesn't have the money in the budget to pay your
>>>prices for a full set? She'll be forced by YOU to take her business
>>>elsewhere then. We're in business to make money & HERS would be gone.
>>>What purpose would that serve?
>>>
>>>If she were my client, I'd mentally prepare myself for when she comes
>>>in (keeping my body language relaxed- not on the defensive) bragging
>>>about her new salon & then I'd just let her talk it out of her
>>>system. I'd keep my head down, fixing those crappy nails so they look
>>>good, & occasionally at the right points in the conversation, I'd
>>>interject the little words that will mean so much to her.... "uh-huh"
>>>& "is that right?" & "no way!" & "you go, girl!". I'd be taking my
>>>ego out of the conversation & using psychology to make the client
>>>feel validated. Eventually, she'll run out of steam & you can direct
>>>the conversation to other things that are important to HER. Aaaahhh,
>>>the honeymoon phase is returning!
>>>
>>>It's a challenge in acting & psychology, but for me it's also
>>>satisfying when it works because everyone leaves happy. One great
>>>thing about being in the South is that you learn how to sugar coat
>>>phrases which have underlying meanings. The best one to remember is
>>>"Well, bless your heart!", which sounds very nice on the surface, &
>>>you can interject it into your next conversation with her when she
>>>says what a great nail job her new tech did. But what you really mean
>>>by that phrase is "Well, you are dumb as a rock"!
>>>
>>>Jill Wright
>>>Event Coordinator & Nail Tech
>>><http://www.nailtechevent.com>www.nailtechevent.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>On Tuesday, November 6, 2012 1:55:18 PM UTC-6, Katherine Fahrig wrote:
>>>Hey Techies,
>>>
>>>I have a client who used to be a regular gel client until she moved
>>>to Florida last year. She now comes to me 3 or 4 times a year. It
>>>wasn't a problem until this visit. She showed up with NSS,
>>>substandard, horrible acrylic nails that are yellowing and have fill
>>>lines. She went on and on about how she found a new salon that is so
>>>beautiful and the guy she goes to is so up to date on all the latest
>>>things and does such beautiful work. I'm looking at horrible, yellow,
>>>fill lines and acrylic ( she was told that it was the new powder gel
>>>that they were using ) and I want to scream! I pointed out the
>>>yellowing and the fill lines, she acknowledged them and then said
>>>something about "taking it all off" for her fill. I told her that she
>>>would have to soak them off for about an hour and then I would do a
>>>full set, for the price of a full set. She said that they just pulled
>>>them off, no hour wasted soaking them off. I had to keep my head down
>>>so she could not see the horror on my face.
>>>
>>>What do you say to someone when presented with this kind of mess?
>>>I did not have the time to soak them off and do a full set, so, I did
>>>not push her to do so. I told her that it was acrylic on her nails
>>>and she said that it was powder gel, didn't I know about it?
>>>I explained that it was not powder gel it was acrylic and she still
>>>insisted that they said it was gel so it is gel. I stopped short of
>>>telling her that they are lying rat finks because she went on and on
>>>about how much she liked the salon and the "guy"
>>>who does her nails and the conversation was quickly turning into an
>>>argument with my client defending her "guy's" flat out lies!
>>>
>>>I'm still trying to get my hormones in balance so I could use some
>>>advice as to what to say and what not to say. In general I do not bad
>>>mouth anyone else's work, but, what do I do when someone is lying
>>>their but off and the client believes them over me? I have
>>>certificates on the wall that prove my advanced education and she's
>>>heard me go on and on about all the conventions, continuing
>>>education, this mailing list, industry web sites and trade
>>>publications that I've gotten all my information from for 25 years
>>>and she still believes that lying sack of *~#t!!!!! Sorry, I fell
>>>into name calling.....not sorry he is a lying sack of _____.
>>>
>>>She was a good client for about a year before she moved to FL, I
>>>educated her while she was in my chair and now she seems to have
>>>forgotten all of it. On her way out she saw my old ProFinish two hand
>>>uv lamp and exclaimed, "that's what they have, the new two hand lamp!
>>>What do you use it for?" I told her that that lamp is a least 15
>>>years old and useless except to get regular polish clients to sit
>>>still for 4 minutes. She looked confused, but, said nothing more.
>>>
>>>I thought about booking 2 hours for her next appointment and soaking
>>>the ac off and putting on a new set of gels so she would be reminded
>>>of how they should look, but, if I'm doing all that work, I'm getting
>>>paid for a full set and she would not agree to that. Besides, she saw
>>>my nails and the clients before and after her with beautiful, clear,
>>>non yellow, no fill lines, gel nails.
>>>Maybe she listened and noticed more than she admitted to and she will
>>>find a new salon in FL that actually does gels, not acrylic (that
>>>turns yellow) with a gel overlay.
>>>
>>>So, Techies, I did a little venting, now, what do you all say to
>>>clients who come in with NSS nails and tell you how beautiful that are?
>>>
>>>Katherine
>>>Nails at Panache
>>>St. Louis, MO
>>>Sent from my iPad
>>>
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