For a source I've used davidsilverspares.uk a Brit firm with the best selection of parts. You really want to "improve the breed" ??? How good are you ? If you have access to the right tools and have the skill, I'll take you on a trip that results in a much improved breed. You're at just the right place, the right time... but you might not be the right person. All you need is a dial gauge, degree wheel, and a Dremel. oh yeah, some regular tools too. The "cold blooded" thing is something you should get used to. Carbs+EPA= :-(
--- On Thu, 4/30/09, tharrisn <[email protected]> wrote: From: tharrisn <[email protected]> Subject: [Nighthawk Lovers] Re: NOISE cont. To: "Nighthawk Motorcycle Lovers!" <[email protected]> Date: Thursday, April 30, 2009, 9:15 AM Dennis, No, no surprises here. Cold running isn't really a big problem. More like an annoyance. Just trying to improve the breed a bit while fixing the much bigger issue with the hydraulic adjuster/tapping noise. I enjoy wrenching and thought since I've got the thing torn down this much might as well check the carbs over. I've always heard these critters are cold blooded but I hardly ever except the status quo when it comes to machines. My mantra is it can always run better, but if it can't I may learn something in the process. I totally agree "do no harm" is first. Actually my bent on the phrase is "don't burn any bridges behind you." The o-rings I'm referring to are just that, o-rings not the carb insulator (what I think you're calling a spigot). The four carb insulators (spigots) are in good shape albeit a little hard. There are two o-rings per insulator so I need to replace all eight. I can appreciate your insistence on details and nomenclature. My nomenclature comes straight from the parts fiche and/or Honda shop manual so I try to be at least as clear as those two resources (addmitedly they aren't too clear sometimes <grin>). Now back to the bigger problem. Do you have any suggestions for salvage yards or other resources for obtaining these oil chamber caps Honda part #12221-ME5-035. I tried my "go-to" source, cyclpartswarehouse, and they don't have 'em. Looked on eBay and have emailed several folks parting out compatible models but no luck so far. On Apr 29, 11:07 pm, Dennis Hammerl <[email protected]> wrote: > Surprise ! Here I thought you were just performing some PM. So you really do have a problem ? Why not tell us about it first instead of the round-about way. Describe your problem in grisly detail. Then I'll give you a sarcastic answer. Or, maybe not (sarcastic) So far you have only wasted your time. Trouble shooting is best performed on an intact motorcycle. Cold engine performance is only a temporary situation. Start up problems ? Running / performance problems ? Let's get terminology down. The O rings ? or are you talking about the spigots ? They age and crack. Replacements may be unobtainium. Another part I don't remove unless I HAVE REASON TO. Disturbing parts on old stuff makes for new problems. Remember, "first, do no harm" Sealing spigots to the head can be done with silicone seal. If any of those were to leak, the result would be a lean condition (as in sucking in air) That you check for by spraying carb cleaner on them when the engine is running > and if they leak, the RPM picks up. (I did say trouble shooting is best done on an intact engine) > Your turn... > > --- On Wed, 4/29/09, tharrisn <[email protected]> wrote: > From: tharrisn <[email protected]> > Subject: [Nighthawk Lovers] Re: NOISE cont. > To: "Nighthawk Motorcycle Lovers!" <[email protected]> > Date: Wednesday, April 29, 2009, 10:10 PM > > Dennis, > > Ok, I'm really bummed. The oil cap I tried to order is unavailable > from my initial source. I'm still looking but I'm beginning to doubt > I'll find such a critter. Do you have any suggestions for good salvage > yards that might have stuff like this. > > While I was waiting for the oil cap to ship (which now will never > happen from that vendor) I removed the carbs and looked 'em over good. > I slid wire down all the jets and made sure they were all the same > size. The slides operated nicely no sticking and a nice "koosh" when > raised and lowered. No varnish or discoloration in the bowls. Did find > the o-rings between the carbs and cylinder to be very brittle and > woefully out of shape. I'm wondering if those might be responsible for > the poor running when cold. Anyway will replace them while I'm at it. > > On Apr 28, 10:54 pm, Dennis Hammerl <[email protected]> wrote:> So much great info has been posted already about this. Start by removing > > the carb pack, which is not all that easy but doable. I remove the throttle > cables from the grip end first to allow enough slack at the carbs. That makes > removing the cables from the carbs a lot easier. It helps to loosen the air box > and slide it back as far as you can. I do not remove the spigots from the head > but some people do. Once all the clamps are loose I use a long bar to pry them > back from the spigots. (be careful how you exert pressure and where) So far, so > good. I will recommend doing one at a time and not removing them from the > "runner" bar that they are attached to. Invert and remove a bowl. > Remove jets and clean. The wire size for the slow jet is .0011" (eleven ten > thousandth of an inch) The jet is the smallest and most often clogged. It > affects drivability and off-idle throttle response. I use Berkbile 2+2 for a > carb cleaner (not available in some states) Wiring out> the slow jet is the only way to ensure the jet is actually open and the > > right size. No, I don't recommend removing the diaphram / slides. First off, > if you had a bad one, you'd know it. Real flat acceleration and poor (very) > poor performance. If you stick a finger into the intake side bore and lift a > slide up and let it fall, they make a very distinct noise. As in whoosh... No > noise, bad slide. Try it and see. If you remove them you run the chance of the > diaphram "growing" and not getting it back into place. This is caused > by the wonderful fuel we have and it's effect on that material. Once > released from the caps and exposed to air, all bets are off. It's happened > too often in our shop. Same thing happens to the bowl gaskets (O ring) . Leave > 'em in place or buy new. "Back in the day", we removed and > inspected all these parts... no longer. But, that's when gas was gas and men > were men.> You can reduce the clearance where the actuator contacts the accellerator > > pump arm if you want to.> I use a silicone spray on the spigots to allow the carbs to slip back in > > when you're done. Liquid soap works just as well.> I do recommend a carb sync after major work like this. > > For what it's worth, I hope this helps. Maybe just use Seafoam ? > > > --- On Tue, 4/28/09, tharrisn <[email protected]> wrote: > > From: tharrisn <[email protected]> > > Subject: [Nighthawk Lovers] Re: NOISE cont. > > To: "Nighthawk Motorcycle Lovers!" > > <[email protected]> > > > Date: Tuesday, April 28, 2009, 8:36 AM > > > I found some caps for the anti-foam chambers and have ordered them. > > Should know shortly if they're available. They weren't too > expensive > > and got a bunch of new o-rings for the oil pipes too. Only found one > > of the eight a little marginal but the manual said replace 'em all. If > > the place I ordered the caps can't get 'em I'll go the sealant > > route. > > > Everything else looked good. No pitting, holes or scarring on the cam > > lobes or bearing surfaces. Before putting the bearing caps back on I > > smeared a very light coat of moly grease on the lobe and bearing > > surfaces. > > > While I have everything kinda apart (I didn't have to remove the > > camshafts totally to get to the hydraulic adjusters) I figured I might > > as well work over the carbs too. Can you point me to a good resource > > for rebuilding the carbs? I think I read you don't recommend removing > > the diaphragms and to use some appropriately sized piano wire to > > insure the jets are clean. Along with the other parts I've ordered new > > o-rings for the carb to cylinder junction. Sure would like to use > > Viton o-rings as replacements but it's REALLY hard to find stuff like > > this locally. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Nighthawk Motorcycle Lovers!" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nighthawk_lovers?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
