Sigh. Oh horrors. It's yet another negative story about how awful certifications are. What ever shall we do....
So. I have had various certifications over the years. I have benefited from having them as well. They are not now a be all end all 'justification' of expertise. They are something that is yet another indicator. I use them as a validation of my study/skill-set expertise. I have read, practiced and understood enough to get the certification. Now, that may not be valuable to you which is fine, but it's a nice indicator that not only do I think I have a good grasp of a given product, per the vendors yardstick, they think I have a grasp of it as well. I have also benefited from having them. With one job it was a choice between me and one other. Both of us had similar resumes and experiences but I had the certifications and they didn't. I got the job. Why? Because I had taken the little extra effort to obtain outside validation of my skills with, yes, that piece of paper. We all have horror stories of people who interviewed well (with and without the piece of paper) and turned out to be wrong in all sorts of ways. That is not because of a piece of paper, that was because the hiring process was flawed. Don't point at the piece of paper to validate your superiority, but by the same token, don't point at a lack of having it as one either. To the point, I am currently updating my pieces of paper to current levels. Why? To validate my understanding of new technologies. To demonstrate (with simple metrics) enough initial competence to pass HR screening check lists. To have them to annoy people who 'claim they could' but for some reason don't. If you claim you could, then prove it or stop knocking down the efforts of those who do bother. Experience trumps a lot, but certifications are a tool that can, when combined with experience, get you ahead in the game. Steven Peck Http://www.blkmtn.org On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 1:42 PM, Garcia-Moran, Carlos <[email protected]> wrote: > For the most part I'm a firm believer that Certs and Test's are no longer > what they used to be. I've been doing IT for around 15+ years, I had an MCP, > never bothered to make it into an MCSE. It wasn't worth it to me. I wouldn't > have learned nothing taking a class that I didn't learn from mentors / peers > / my own research and reading. Requiring an MCSE for a position is a joke, > would you pay the person more? Salaries rarely ever go up it you take Certs. > > > > Let me tell you a quick story about certs I was working for a company once > and I was the supervisor of a 5 person desktop IT team. They decided to > hire a more senior guy once one of my team members left, I wasn't involved > in the process except for giving my bosses needs /wants for the position. > Well they hired an MCSE guy that had more certs that I could shake a stick > at. Well after about two months of working together and him consistently > failing to do simple things, like If 4 of us could print and he couldn't he > would start taking the printer network device apart since that had to be the > problem. I sat down and drilled him about his skills , prior to his hiring > he was a carpenter but decided to switch jobs he did a 6 month tech stint a > small company as desktop support and then took a Boot camp MCSE, which was > the major factor in the hiring process that my bosses used. He was USELESS! > > > > From: Brian Desmond [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 4:29 PM > To: NT System Admin Issues > Subject: RE: SUSPECT: RE: MCSE question > > > > Someone who knows what they're doing should be able to demonstrate that they > can do that without an MCSE. I know a bunch of REALLY good Windows people > who have no MS certs and never will. > > > > Likewise, someone who knows pretty much nothing but is good at taking tests > can be an MCSE without much trouble. > > > > Thanks, > > Brian Desmond > > [email protected] > > > > c - 312.731.3132 > > > > From: Dennis Rogov [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 3:25 PM > To: NT System Admin Issues > Subject: Re: SUSPECT: RE: MCSE question > > > > i think it really depands on your IT department and the task that you > handle. I strongly belive that for someone who has been in IT and works with > Windows platform should have an MCSE. When i look to hire engineers to my > team for mid and senior admin position i require MCSE. As far as other > vendor certs in my eyes VCP and CCA are something that each mid and senior > level engineer should posses. But once again it depands on your > infastructure as there is no sense to have a CCA if you dont run citrix... > As the senior egineer and network manager i am investigating Project manager > certification let faceit most task you do in windows is a project and > requires involment multiple departments. > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: "Ziots, Edward" <[email protected]> > To: NT System Admin Issues <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, February 5, 2009 3:57:54 PM > Subject: RE: SUSPECT: RE: MCSE question > > Point taken, > > > > Just too burnt out trying to be everyones "go-to" guy, so might be time for > a change… > > > > Z > > > > Edward E. Ziots > > Network Engineer > > Lifespan Organization > > Email: [email protected] > > Phone: 401-639-3505 > > MCSE, MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network + > > ________________________________ > > From: Tim Vander Kooi [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 3:54 PM > To: NT System Admin Issues > Subject: SUSPECT: RE: MCSE question > > > > For those into security ISC is great. For those of us who are not security > folks, it is of little to no value. > > Some of us like being Sys Admins. > > J > > > > > > From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 2:25 PM > To: NT System Admin Issues > Subject: SUSPECT: RE: MCSE question > Importance: High > > > > People are still running the M$ cert rat race? > > > > Rather just do ISC(2) certs and have CPE's than take the exams everything > 2-3 years. Honestly, it be really nice to see M$ adopt that mentality, they > never will tho. > > > > Only Cert in M$ I am looking to do is MCTS/MCTIP in SQL 2005/2008. (SQL 2005 > is a lot of fun, once you learn it, and I am stoked about 2k8 enhancements) > > > > Other than that its CISSP/SSCP/CEH/CISA/CISM and then out of sys_admin hell > for me.. > > > > Z > > > > Edward E. Ziots > > Network Engineer > > Lifespan Organization > > Email: [email protected] > > Phone: 401-639-3505 > > MCSE, MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network + > > ________________________________ > > From: Kennedy, Jim [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 12:58 PM > To: NT System Admin Issues > Subject: RE: MCSE question > > > > The upgrade exams retired in March of 2008. So what you have to do now is go > through the whole thing for 2008. > > > > > > From: Gavin Wilby [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 12:57 PM > To: NT System Admin Issues > Subject: Re: MCSE question > > > > Yes. > > 2009/2/4 Dennis Rogov <[email protected]> > > > > Hi all > > > > I have a question about certifications: > > > > I am currently certified Windows 2000 MCSE and would like to renew my certs > to stay competivite in this market. Can i take the upgrade test to 03 > Windows > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: John Hornbuckle <[email protected]> > To: NT System Admin Issues <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2009 3:50:54 PM > Subject: RE: Comcast pays customers to watch porn! > > They pay people $10 for being exposed to 30 seconds of porn, but won't > credit me jack for having an outage that keeps me offline for hours or days? > > > > > > > > John Hornbuckle > > MIS Department > > Taylor County School District > > 318 North Clark Street > > Perry, FL 32347 > > > > www.taylor.k12.fl.us > > > > > > > > From: Jake Gardner [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 3:39 PM > To: NT System Admin Issues > Subject: OT: Comcast pays customers to watch porn! > > > > http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5hh0DjqPF9rK8q1skduiPinoJO2Jw > > > > Thanks, > > > > Jake Gardner > > TTC Network Administrator > > Ext. 246 > > > > > > > > > > ***Teletronics Technology Corporation*** > This e-mail is confidential and may also be privileged. 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